In a recent blog post, Vitamin B6 improves dream recall (which can be used to monitor vitamin B6 status), I promised to address concerns about the potential for vitamin B6 toxicity. I have yet to see any signs of toxicity in my clients, but I have also not ever recommended more than 500mg/day.
However, I was recently made aware (thanks to some folks in my community) that there are some individuals who have issues with very small amounts of vitamin B6. As of this writing I don’t know why this occurs but I’m writing about it in the hope we can start to put some of the puzzle pieces together. If you have experienced any issues with using vitamin B6 supplements please do share in the comments.
I’d like to start with what we know from the research and from experts like Dr. Carl Pfeiffer – since B6 is water soluble, excesses are documented to be excreted via the urine so that toxic levels are never reached.
It is common knowledge that amounts of 50 mg or greater are considered therapeutic and a high dose, and you should reduce your dose if you notice any tingling in your fingers and other extremities. This could be a sign of too much vitamin B6 and is called peripheral neuropathy. Because vitamin B6 is water soluble, this condition is reported to be completely reversible if you stop supplementing with vitamin B6 or reduce your dose. In one case report, some patients were using up to 5000mg/day, and once they stopped the vitamin B6 their symptoms improved.
In his book Mental and Elemental Nutrients, published in 1975, Dr. Pfeiffer stated:
excesses are excreted via the urine so that toxic levels are never reached. Pyridoxic acid occurs in the urine of patients who take any excess of vitamin B6. This is a harmless excretion product.
He had some of his patients with pyroluria use 1000mg twice a day but recommended working with a practitioner if using amounts higher than 500mg. I agree with the latter.
You’ll see varied research papers on what is considered too high a dose. In this paper, How much vitamin B6 is toxic?, the authors report that 1000mg per day or more causes neuropathy. They also share that there
have also been occasional reports of toxicity at intakes of 100-300 mg per day [and that a report of] neurotoxicity in 2 patients who had taken 24 mg and 40 mg of vitamin B6 per day respectively, may be coincidence rather than a true toxic effect of such relatively low doses.
In the USA, per this article on the NIH site, the upper limit is set at 100mg/day. This is the rationale:
several reports show sensory neuropathy occurring at doses lower than 500 mg/day, studies in patients treated with vitamin B6 (average dose of 200 mg/day) for up to 5 years found no evidence of [neurological issues].
Based on limitations in the data on potential harms from long-term use, the FNB halved the dose used in these studies to establish a UL [upper limit] of 100 mg/day for adults. ULs are lower for children and adolescents based on body size.
As I mentioned above, I have yet to see any signs of toxicity in my clients, but I have also not ever recommended more than 500mg/day.
Psychosis that resolves when vitamin B6 is stopped
A colleague shared this about 2 patients developing psychosis as a result of using too much vitamin B6:
I have had 2 patients in the past 3 years who developed psychosis as a result of taking too much vitamin B6. I think it’s a fine line between what is enough for some people, and then what becomes too much. While some may be able to handle large doses of B6, we know that at higher doses it can cause severe problems for other people. It’s a nutrient I dose and monitor carefully for sure.
There is no research on acute psychosis and vitamin B6 toxicity but she shares this:
neuropathy and psychosis (or acute mental health symptoms) often co-occur, so to me it makes sense that a person could experience both together as a result of too much vitamin B6. In both the patients the acute psychotic symptoms resolved once they stopped taking high doses of B6. They were both taking pyridoxine HCL at doses above 500mg daily (one because of information she had read online, and the other because another practitioner had recommended it). My guess is there is some genetic factor and/or mediating factor biologically that makes some people susceptible to a negative response.
Serious issues that are not resolved when vitamin B6 is stopped
Clearly there are some individuals who do have serious issues that are not resolved when they stop taking vitamin B6. In the previous blog, Vitamin B6 improves dream recall (which can be used to monitor vitamin B6 status), Ruth shared this feedback about her experience with vitamin B6 toxicity:
Trudy, I appreciate your evidence-based approach to health issues, but I think you need to be aware that there are dangers in taking too much synthetic vitamin B6. B6 toxicity is not always reversible. Individuals vary in their response to B6, and while many do well on supplementation, others experience toxicity. I was diagnosed with pyroluria, but experienced serious toxicity.
Vitamin B6 toxicity is a very unrecognized but emerging epidemic that can cause widespread neurological damage to the body. It is not commonly recognized by most of the medical community and is often misdiagnosed. B6 toxicity can cause multiple different symptoms that can vary from person to person. Peripheral neuropathy or nerve damage to the feet, legs or hands is one of the most common symptoms of vitamin B6 toxicity. Tingling, shocks/zaps, vibrations, ataxia, burning, numbness of feet, calves and/or hands, and headaches are also commonly reported. Other symptoms are: ocular, sensory, skin, gastrointestinal and psychological.
I appreciate Ruth sharing this and am very concerned that this is happening. And yes, vitamin B6 is synthetic, but I am not yet convinced that this could be the only cause as there are other synthetic/man-made supplements (such as GABA) that don’t cause issues like this.
However, we do need to know why some folks have issues and why these issues continue even when the vitamin B6 supplementation is stopped.
Possible clues as to why vitamin B6 toxicity occurs?
If you have had issues that persist I’d ask these questions which may start to give us clues as to why this occurs:
- What were/are your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues?
- Have you resolved the symptoms and if yes how?
- Did you make any other changes around the same time i.e. stopping and/or other nutritional support?
- Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking?
- And how much did you take and how often?
- If you have pyroluria were you also taking zinc and how much? (Dr. Pfeiffer recommended taking zinc together with vitamin B6).
It seems like this an emerging issue unless there is just now more awareness because of the web and more ability to share on forums, blogs and social media.
If we are to assume this is a new and emerging issue I would ask what has changed since the 1970s when Dr. Carl Pfeiffer used high doses (as I mentioned above, up to 1000mg twice a day) with no adverse effects?
These factors have wide-reaching adverse effects and may be triggering a toxic reaction in certain susceptible individuals:
- Past history or current use of certain medications like benzodiazepines, gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP, SSRIs, fluroquinolone antibiotics, PPIs, diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc.? (If you have not used the above medications have you been exposed to them via drinking water?)
- Our increased EMF exposure – WiFi, cell phones, cordless phone and smart meters?
- Our increased exposure to GMOs, glyphosate, plastics/phthalates, pesticides etc.?
- Interactions with all of the above and/or certain polymorphisms – we know cytochrome P450 polymorphisms make benzodiazepines more toxic and more difficult to taper in about 60% of those prescribed benzodiazepines
Keep in mind that for most individuals, vitamin B6 causes no issues and is an important nutrient for improving the symptoms of pyroluria/social anxiety, reducing inflammation and oxidative stress, easing PMS and hormonal issues and much more. I share links to the research on the many benefits of supplemental vitamin B6 in this blog: Vitamin B6 improves dream recall (which can be used to monitor vitamin B6 status).
That being said, we need to know why some individuals do have issues when using vitamin B6.
Please share in the comments if you have seen adverse issues with vitamin B6 supplementation
If you have been adversely affected and feel comfortable sharing answers to the following questions in the comments this may help us try and piece the puzzle together:
- What were/are your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues?
- Have you resolved the symptoms and if yes how?
- Did you make any other changes around the same time i.e. stopping and/or other nutritional support?
- Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking?
- And how much did you take and how often?
- If you have pyroluria were you also taking zinc and how much? (Dr. Pfeiffer recommended taking zinc together with vitamin B6).
- Past history or current use of medications like benzodiazepines (such as Ativan, Xanax, valium etc.), gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP / birth control pill, SSRIs /antidepressants (such as Prozac, Celexa, Lexapro, Paxil, Zoloft etc.), fluroquinolone antibiotics (such as ciprofloxacin/Cipro, gemifloxacin/Factive, levofloxacin/Levaquin, moxifloxacin/Avelox, norfloxacin/Noroxin and ofloxacin/Floxin), PPIs (proton pump inhibitors such as Nexium for heart-burn), diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc.?
- What kind of EMF exposure do you have – WiFi in the home and/or at work, how much cell phone use in a day, cordless phones at home and/or work and a smart meter at home?
- What kind of exposure have you had to GMOs and pesticides (i.e. do you only eat organic food), glyphosate (eg. Roundup exposure from lawns, golf courses, parks etc.), plastics/phthalates (do you avoid plastics)?
- What polymorphisms do you have: cytochrome P450 polymorphisms (we know some of these make benzodiazepines more toxic and more difficult to taper in about 60% of those prescribed these meds), and/or MTHFR polymorphism (may affect our detox ability if it’s expressing) and others you know about?
- Did you take a B complex (or a multivitamin that contains all the B vitamins) with the vitamin B6?
- Did you also take magnesium with the vitamin B6 and if yes how much? (Bernie Rimland reported that taking vitamin B6 together with magnesium resulted in an improved behavior of ASD (autism spectrum patients))
- Have you observed any correlation with intake of dietary oxalates i.e. worsening symptoms when consuming medium or high oxalate foods (such as spinach, kale, berries, nuts, kiwi fruit, eggplant etc.) or using vitamin C or milk thistle, and less severe symptoms when consuming a low oxalate diet? (Susan Owens is founder of www.lowoxalate.info and shares that vitamin B6 is the most efficacious vitamin for reducing oxalates and that we also don’t know if the classic signs of vitamin B6 toxicity has anything to do with oxalate dumping symptoms.)
- Do you have a thyroid disease? “peripheral diseases frequently include polyneuropathy”
- Have you been diagnosed with an autoimmune condition and if yes, which one?
Is there anything else that you have discovered that you suspect may be a factor?
I plan to add to this list of questions as we get feedback and as I learn more.
To be clear, I’m not dismissing the fact that vitamin B6 toxicity is a real issue for certain individuals. I’m simply trying to figure out if there are some common factors that may be making symptoms worse in some individuals or setting someone up to be predisposed to symptoms or even preventing healing/recovery from toxicity.
What is your thoughts of P5P? Is it a better form of vitamin b6?
Beng
With regards to the active form of vitamin B6 i.e. pyridoxal-5-phosphate (P5P) I don’t have an answer right now. I use both vitamin B6 and P5P with clients (starting with vitamin B6 and then adding in P5P for some individuals) and have not seen issues with either.
I’m hoping to get some feedback from those who have/have had issues
I’m curious to hear your experiences?
I w-as taking Pyridoxine equiv. 41 mg but only took 1/4 tab or less for carpal tunnel I developed. No health practioner involved. Beforehand I had googled RDV which is a tiny 1.3-1.7 mg. Also read toxicity can cause nerve damage to arms legs, is why I only took about only 3, 1/4 . And read mobility may no return for 1 yr. Or pos. Never. Was also taking a 5mg multi B only 1/4. I believed B’s were water soluble. First in bed calf muscle twisted, limping pain from foot. Bought another multi vit with 41 mg, but only tip. Was walking along & couldn’t walk, only days after. Little ability in right leg pain in buttock. MRI said oedema on hip & wanted more tests. I remembered I’d stuck note on Vit. bottle, Knew immed was B6 overdose. Difficult to find but one sight said med & practitioners widely believe myth B vids leave body in urine. Says has a Half-Life of 30-33 days. This unlocks the mystery why symptoms to city prevail after stopping. True, after this amt. Of days I walked again pain free. More proof, today I stupidly took 2 cut pieces of the 41mg tab over 2 days. Today buttock & thigh out of action again. B6 involved with myelin which is outer of nerves think. I’m positive I’ve suffered small dose toxicity. 100mg ingested is bull. B6 dangerous to babies as it’s innocently prescribed for morning sickness. Period pain, gastro.Ppl. visit naturopath & babies may be miscarrying some born floppy. Women take a multi bit when pregnant for the folic acid content. B6 accumulates. Women could be being misdiagnosed fluid condition while prev. If suddenly you Can’t walk you assume bone cancer or MS. Not so, it’s the most innocent thing you would never suspect unless you were an inquisitive mind & googled b6 toxicity. B6.
We know that P5P hurts members with B6 Toxicity. Please join our group on Facebook: Understanding B6 Toxicity with Western Research to learn more, avoid misinformation, and to finally heal.
Are you still available?? I have toxic level of b6 from gabapentin and a anxiety pill. I need some help. Idk what to do or where to go or anything. Please let me know?
Hi Trudy,
Please see our citizen petition to the FDA regarding vitamin B6 toxicity.
We are recommending FDA remove OTC status of vitamin B6 over 10 mg per day and designate them as “prescription only” and also put a warning label on all vitamin B6. General public buying vitamin over-the-counter assumes everything is safe. There is no warning or any “package insert” with any vitamin pointing to their side effects. Unlike other B vitamins (B1, B12, etc), vitamin B6 toxicity has severe effect and may be irreversible. While B6 is water soluble, it does not leave the body as Pyridoxine. It will have to convert to Pyridoxic Acid, with a half life of 45 days. For most patients, it may take up to 6 months to get back to 90% of their normal self. There is lots of good data in our citizen petition. I urge your audience to read it. It is on our website. Ron Najafi, Ph.D. CEO of Emery Pharma
And please do not hesitate to reach out to me by email. You can contact me through our website as well.
Trudy,
I have just found out I have B6 toxicity. I also have low Thiamine. The Labs were done because of neuropathy and unstable balance.
I have been on the Whole 30 plan so NO sugar, dairy, grains or legumes, no alcohol for 6 weeks. I do not take a multivitamin. My B6 was > 2000. Could a statin or a PPI cause this?
B6 makes me a lunatic! I went to a wellness clinic years ago and got shots of it because they said it would help my anxiety and stress levels and make me happy. It did the exact opposite to me. My anxiety went through the roof. I wasn’t sure that it was the problem until I took it again in a Vitamin given to me by my doctor and had severe anxiety. Scary scary thoughts.
Today I have been going back through the last week in my mind. I recently weened off of Venlafaxine. My last dose was almost a month ago. My anxiety climbed to new heights this week. Like never before! As I sit here, I realized the zero sugar sweetner drops I have been putting in my water contained B6.
I’ve also had the worst muscle pains since September after I had Covid-19. And I drank tons of water with these drops in it… Not knowing
I’ll know tomorrow after not consuming any if it was the issue.
you may soon be inundated by comments from the facebook b6 toxicity group of which i am a member. thanks for taking an interest. most of us found out quite by accident about our toxicity issue. i was prescribed folbic (compounded bs) by my internist for elevated homocysteine. when it didn’t work, she doubled the dose thinking water soluble meant no problem. i took this for years (90 mg) and then received additional b6 through other sources (fortified foods and supplements). first sign was onset of erythromelalgia in 2015; turns out i have small fiber neuropathy (diagnosed in 2018). tingling in hands as well. learned about toxicity through neuropathy help groups. checked my levels 2 months ago and it was 240 (upper limit of 21); stopped supplements and now at 46. still have symptoms, but detoxing with help of functional medicine practitioner. genetic analysis reveals poor detox and methylation genes (MTHFR plus others). i have been on birth control, now HRT; also histamine positive; have autoimmune issues; have taken many courses of antibiotics in my lifetime; regularly exposed to EFMs although now wear protective device; eat mostly clean and paleo but not throughout my lifetime; found glysophate among other toxins in my tissues; used both types of b6 before stopping completely. I think this is an under-recognized problem by the medical community in general. there are academic studies that reveal significant toxicity in individuals on far less than 500 mg. some of us don’t eliminate, probably based on various exposures and our genetic makeup.
I am new to this group and this is my first comment.
I took b complex containing 100mcg b6 believing it gave me energy. I think my symptoms might be related. I have permanent severe neuropathic pain in legs mainly. Even though I stopped taking it four years ago.
Carol
Thanks for contributing and sorry to hear about this. I think you may mean 100 mg and not 100 mcg vitamin B6? Please feel free to answer some of the questions posed in the blog.
Suzanne
Thanks for sharing and sorry to hear about your issues. Glad to hear your’re detoxing with the help of functional medicine practitioner. May I ask what’s helping?
I’m curious if a low oxalate diet has been looked into and if it’s helped with the erythromelalgia and other symptoms. In this forum someone reported it helped with the erythromelalgia https://www.livingwitherythromelalgia.org/t/who-diagnosed-you-and-what-meds-are-actually-working-for-you/2318/44 I was never diagnosed with erythromelalgia but a low oxalate diet has helped my dreadful burning feet pain which used to feel like hot coals and shards of glass.
Folbic is new to me so pasting info here. None of this likely plays a role in the B6 issues but 1.13mg of methylfolate is too high for many folks, the form of B12 is not great and many of the other ingredients are nasty!
FOLBIC® RF is a medical food for the dietary management of hyperhomocysteinemia.
Each round, coated, beige colored tablet contains:
L-methylfolate Calcium (as Metafolin®)*…1.13mg
Pyridoxine HCl…..25mg
Cyanocobalamin 2mg
*CAS#151533-22-1
Other Ingredients:
Silicified Microcrystalline Cellulose NF, Opadry II Beige 40L17427 [color] (hypromelloses, titanium dioxide [color], polydextrose, triacetin, polyethylene glycol 8000, FD&C yellow No. 6** aluminum lake [color], FD&C blue No. 2 aluminum lake [color], FD&C red No. 40 aluminum lake [color]), Magnesium Stearate (Vegetable Source), Carnauba Wax
**Contains FD&C Yellow No. 6 as a color additive.
FOLBIC® RF does not contain lactose, sugar or gluten.
http://www.bpirx.com/html/index.aspx?page=products&showdetails=yes&pageid=&tabid=&mainproductid=0&subproductid=123&productbrandid=#
I also have very high numbers. 169. I would like to know how you are detoxing? How long this whole process has been for you and how you are doing? My numbers were 169 in April 2018, got down to 30 in July. Now it’s October and I’m doing worse than ever. Im on gabapentin and propranolol and seems that know thing will work. Tremors and muscle twitching has gotten worse. Can’t sleep. Im losing hope
I have been taking B6 for about two years and I just found out it might be causing the tingling , pins and needles in my feet , legs and sometimes in my hands, I would like to join your group, to learn more about this B6 vitamin, which I have stopped taking three days ago. Thank you, Linda
I was taking small amounts tip off a 41 Pyridoxine tab, prob only 5mg & a multi B 5mg tip. RDV is a tiny 1.3mg – 1.7! I had read toxicity can cause nerve damage to arms & legs. Is why I was only cutting bits off tabs. At that stage my calf twisted weird like a cramp with pain & limp left foot. I still took a 1/4 or 1/2 5 mg multi B. I foolishly bought a multi B Complex, 75 mg B6. I was seeking the Inositol in it. Again I only cut a tip off but it must have been an intolerable amt.eg. 8mg. Next day or more I was walking & my right leg almost gave way. Small amt of ability to walk. Excruciating shooting pain in buttock & upper thigh. I had MRI saw oedema on hip. Dr. wanted CT scans I refused. I remembered note I’d put on Vit. bottle damage & may take 1 yr to mobile again or may never. Another w’site said b6 has Half-Life of 33 days & an incorrect belief it’s removed urine being water-soluble. Exactly my experience I started walking again pain-free in approx 1 mths. But last night I took a tip of that 75 mg tab & pain & some difficulty walking. I’ve taken diuretic cranberry powder as says reputed way of flushing B6. I worry women take even daily 5mg multi vit for folic acid & says for morning sickness. Women visit naturopath & if they read b6 is non-toxic or can have 100mg. Imagine how much they are given. Med. & practititioner world clueless. B6 effects myelin assoc. with nerve ends. Enough for me to believe the smoking gun I couldn’t walk for a month.
If you Google enough, Vit. B6 toxicity you will see advancements in learning. Eg. B6 has a Half-Life of 33 days.So all doses Don’t flush out. Can effect nerves to arms & legs as was my case couldn’t walk,pain in buttock. Regained walking after 1 mth. I only had small amounts excess eg.4-8mg peridoxine daily. When I took 10, 2 day before ﹰﹰI could barely walk, ﹰﹰI’d only had 10 mg. But I was effected toxic being vegetarian said to up-take vids more having no animal fat lining gut. W’site says may take 1 yr. to walk again efficiently or some don’t. I walked as I connected to B6 toxic. Neurotoxin involved with nerve end myelin. And RDV is a low 1.3- 1.7 mg daily. I walked a lot hope to stimulate the damaged nerves. Try walking.
I have homocystenuria and take vitamin B6,betaine, b12 and folic acid for it. After being on vitamin B6 for 12 years I developed mild neuropathy but my homocysteine levels are good. After 15 years of being on B6 I started developing horrible pain in my feet and started having balance problems.the pain became so bad I couldn’t sleep at night I would go three to four night without sleeping and eventuality fall asleep from physical exhaustion.
I went to my neurologist and she checked my b6 levels and it was toxic it was over 3 times the normal level. I stopped the b6 for 6 months months with doctors advice how taper off . My b6 levels dropped to near normal but my neuropathy didn’t improve at all. It was still painful and debilatating I ended up having to wear braces to walk because my balance was so bad and I had to have a spinal cord stimulator put in for pain . A little later they put me on oxycodone and eventually a 25mcg transdermal fentanyl patch. All that took the edge off the pain but I still couldn’t drive and had to wear braces to walk .
While I was off the B6 the homocysteine levels got so bad I was at high risk for clots and another stroke I recovered from my first stroke God was looking out for me. After 6 months of not taking the B6 I was advised to go back up to 500 mg . After a month of being on 500mg of b6 my homocysteine levels were good meaning the chances of blood clots was very low it be two years now at 500 mg of B6 again and the homocysteine levels are good the neuropathy isn’t any worse but the doctors said it wouldn’t get any worse because the mylien sheath covering the nerves were gone.
I had everything genetic test possible to see if anything else could have caused the neuropathy but nothing was found . I don’t drink or smoke.Ive only it through this because of my parents and my faith in God. Just lately I’ve had uncontrollable highs and lows in blood pressure an my body temperature fluctuates so the the high dosages of b6 might be causing autony neuropathy.
I just people to know this because eventually b6 in high dosages 500mg will eventually destroy your body so be careful in your decisions about B6 live every day like its your last and have faith in God that eventually you’ll be in a better place and have a good support system like you family thanks mom and dad
I saw somewhere that there is a genomic Rh commonality, yet rare, to B complex. I cant recall the genome but I thought it was something along the line of Rh2228??? Does anyone know what th I can’t find it again.e exact number of the genome is?
Hi there Trudy
I’m researching this topic based on the fact I’ve recently discovered my b6 levels are majorly high and I do have symptoms of toxicity. I’m not sure how
Long they have been that way but was hospitalised a few years ago with extreme pain , bowel symptoms, urinary retention and psychosis. I also had an episode being unable to walk and also zapping like pain that caused insomnia and what I describe as a complete nervous System breakdown . Still do not know what caused this . I have ehlers danlos syndrome and mast cell disorder aswell as gastroparesis
As at 29 November 2023, the latest research indicates that for some, P5P might be the better form of B6 to take, never the less, extreme intake of pyridoxine hydrochloride and/or P5P may remain in your small nerves and cause disability, particularly walking, balance, pain and several dozen other annoying symptoms. Small nerves include sensory nerves and those of the autonomic nervous system which control heart, temperature and breathing. So when exercising or attempting to pace out, the heart rate may not increase enough to compensate, and for the same reason, you may have to take deeper breaths which normally should occur automatically. Night sweats are common when autonomic temperature adjustments do not occur. For too long, when patients complained of pins and needles in their extremities (so called ‘stocking/glove effect’), doctors had not been prompted to obtain a B6 pathology report until recently when the Australian Medical Association recognised the increased reporting of B6 toxicity and alerted members. The Australian Government recommends no more than 10mg of B6 intake daily and that products contain no more than 50mg as stated on the label, however the writing does not include the advice that 50mg daily is the maximum intake from all sources, not just that one bottle. Most people don’t need more than 1.3mg daily, which is a far cry from the 1 gram that was once considered safe. About 250 people in 1000 who are taking excessive amounts end up with debilitating symptoms which may not have resolved after 18 months, and may never, depending on how high the dose was, how long the intake, and the degree of an individual’s tolerance, which may have been hardly much higher than the minimum requirement. As soon as one suspects that B6 toxicity might be the culprit of their woes, seek medical advice ASAP. If overdosing, the sooner you cease, the better the outcome, sometimes as soon as weeks. Although some sites say the latter condition is incurable, it is suggested that the reader keep up to date by asking questions in Artificial Intelligence sites which seem to offer the more reliable answers with sources, as opposed to Dr Google which mostly doesn’t mention any date or source, outdated, ( should have been removed) or lifted from a research statement uploaded out of context.
Hi Trudy,
Decades ago I remember health nut gurus suggesting to use B vitamins for stress control and PMS also. I used a mix of B vitamins for a while and it seemed a waste of money for me. Then I remember stories coming out in the news about people getting nerve damage from excessive B vitamins. Pretty sure most of the problems they were seeing was from B6 at that time. One thing that has come to the surface lately is that folic acid is man made and doesn’t do at all what natural folate does in the body. Folic acid is toxic over 400 mcg. Where as, natural folate in your food is not, and it does good things in the right amount for you.
I have noticed with a low carb diet that mostly every nutrient I need is plentiful. I feel much better not getting the large amounts of carbage I used to get. My mood is so much better and I am losing weight easily. But I understand that others may need vitamins. But I think the first place to start is to fix addictive habits like eating sugar and snacking. One reason that I think this, is because girls with PCOS have a host of problems. Many times they are insulin resistant, suffer panic attacks, skin issues, lost periods, infertility, are overweight and can have excessive body hair. But when they fast, bringing down blood sugar and fasting insulin levels, they become well. So that means that excessive carbs and sugars are bad for most people as we already know, but, it is devastating for even the young. Diabetes, panic attacks, depression and messed up hormones are not the way to enjoy youth. Ditching my sugar and grain carbs is so far, the best thing I have implemented for my health and mind.
Keep up the good work Trudy,
Jo
Jo
Glad to hear the low carb diet is working so well for you! Are you grain-free?
Yes, grain free. Energy is increasing even though sleep is somewhat challenged by being so low carb. But that should change as my body adjusts to eating just veggies for my carbs. I am concentrating on less cheese right now because it can force up fasting insulin according to the insulin index. I find that the insulin index works really good for weight loss and actually feeling better while you diet. And of course the insulin index is not very complete at this point in time. And it is surprising the foods that spike fasting insulin and will make it harder to lose weight, but they will not spike blood sugar, weird. Sort of like some fake sugars will make no blood sugar action but still raise insulin. At some point I will add some starchy things but not grains or sugar.
I really think that big pharma should work on creating a drug that simply stops hedonic eating in its tracks and the obesity/diabetes epidemic would be over. Mostly all trouble eating in a healthy way is disrupted by just our natural lust for a taste or sensation. Big pharma would lose lots of money in other ways, so I wonder how motivated they are to find a safe appetite inhibitor to temporary use while people train themselves to eat better.
I want to create a t-shirt movement that says, “Food is good but not that crazy good”, and it would have a picture of a people standing at an all you can eat bar with plates full of food and desserts, and at the end of the bar is a selection of caskets! I actually, do say to myself, “Food is good but not that good.” That it is my reality check that I use to sober me up when temptation is presented to me.
I have no gallbladder but don’t seem to have any trouble getting my vitamins out of my food. I do take CDP choline to help my brain, it is like a nootropic and I like it. Once again if big pharma would address the problem of hedonic eating and what goes on in the brain and emotions, it would get rid of almost all obesity and diabetes. And, for that matter poor nutrient.
Thanks Trudy,
Joanne
I was very interested to read what you wrote about even small doses of B6/pyridoxine as a possible cause of peripheral neuropathy and gastrointestinal issues. I added up what I have been taking daily in 3 different supplements, which came to 99 mg. While this does not seem like an excessive amount, I had never had any symptoms of neuropathy before I started taking these supplements about 10 months ago (and I am not diabetic), and I first noticed the beginnings of symptoms about 8 months ago, which have grown progressively worse in the past 6 months. I am wondering what polymorphism test needs to be done to determine whether I am one of the people especially sensitive to developing peripheral neuropathy from taking even small amounts of Vitamin B6. Thank you very much for writng this informative article, which may help answer why I suddely developed this problem.
Kathryn
Thank you for sharing and sorry to hear this. I’m hoping to piece the puzzle pieces together by having those with issues answer a list of questions if it feels comfortable to do so. I just updated the blog adding those questions at the bottom to make it clearer. I suspect it’s likely a combination of factors and not just one polymorphism. I wonder if the liver CYP450 or MTHFR polymorphisms may be involved.
I need b 6 toxicity help
I experienced the same symptoms , Neuropathy, Gastritis, etc, from taking a Super B Complex, Multi Vitamin, and lots of B6 foods ! The symptoms got worse and worse with debilitating Peripheral Neuropathy , preceeded by Heartburn and Gastritis…I totally agree to Not Take B6 in Isolated B Vitamins ! I Had many Doctors and
Every Neurology Test Possible , and No Answers, until I stopped taking B6 !!!
Am getting better by the Day, after a few weeks of eliminating B6 !!! I am obviously Very Sensitive to it, as many might Be !
How about methylated b6?
Is there a difference there?
Julia
If you’re referring to the active form of vitamin B6 i.e. pyridoxal-5-phosphate (P5P) I don’t have an answer right now. I use both vitamin B6 and P5P with clients (starting with vitamin B6 and then adding in P5P for some individuals) and have not seen issues with either.
I’m hoping to get some feedback from those who have/have had issues
I’m curious to hear your experiences?
I made an appointment with a neurologist because I had burning feet. He gave me a blood test that showed that I had very elevated B6 to be precise it was 840 mg. I was at the time taking One a day vitamin and also a B- Complex. I was also feeling very tired, my vision was getting blurred to the point that I had to make an appointment with my ophthalmologist ( I had cataract surgery few years ago ) that found changes in my vision and gave me a prescription. In the meantime I stopped taking B6. My burning topped, my tiredness improved and my vision was also back to normal. Today I picked up my new pair of glasses, they felt like they were not my prescription, I could not look and focus . They could not be my prescription!!! Since I stopped my B6 My view is back to normal. I have to make an appointment with my ophthalmologist!
I have MTHFR gene mutation. I had toxic blood levels and severe poly neuropathy. I wasn’t able to process the synthetic form of b6. I was taking a b complex multivitamin and drinking energy drinks. Try getting bloodwork to test your b6 level and if you have any genetic mutations.
Thank you for all your information Trudy!
I don`t take any synthetic B vitamins. I get my B6 from bee pollen and I take grass fed liver capsules for B12 because I cant stomach liver. Synthetic B’s (in any form) lower potassium and depletes ceruloplasmin which is an important protein/enzyme in the liver needed to make copper usable in the body which in turn makes iron bio-available in the body. Since taking natural B from food, my vit B12 has gone up from 500 to 600 and I havent checked my B6 yet. I think I will continue to stick to the real deal and not trust anything synthetic.
Mandi
Thanks for sharing and glad to hear bee pollen and grass fed liver capsules are working for you!
Do you have a source for this statement please? I’d like to look further in to this – “Synthetic B’s (in any form) lower potassium and depletes ceruloplasmin which is an important protein/enzyme in the liver needed to make copper usable in the body which in turn makes iron bio-available in the body”
Keep in mind that despite that fact that vitamin B6 is synthetic, many people do benefit from supplementation and we have so much research and clinical evidence supporting it’s use. I write about some of it here https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/vitamin-b6-improves-dream-recall-which-can-be-used-to-monitor-vitamin-b6-status/
The goal of this post is not to discredit synthetic vitamin B6 but rather to try and help those who are adversely affected.
Synthetic ‘B’s deplete ceruloplasmin.
In order to become usable in the body, synthetic B Vitamins need to be ‘kissed’ by ceruloplasmin. Synthetic vitamins do not contain ceruloplasmin, so ceruloplasmin is pulled out of the body in order to process the vitamins. When levels are already low in the body, this process just depletes levels still further.
The message therefore, is to avoid synthetic B Vitamins (as with other synthetic vitamins) and to use wholefood sources instead, which contain the whole molecule, not just a part molecule, which the body can process and utilize much more effectively.
Synthetic B vitamins stimulate the body, whereas wholefood B vitamins help to rebuild tissues, so are better.
Mandi
I’m aware that the topic of synthetic vs whole food supplements is a hotly debated topic but per the research (links in my blog) and the excellent results so many individuals experience when using synthetic supplements like vitamin B6, I don’t feel we can make such a broad statement. However I am curious about what you’re saying and I’d love to see some research links or articles about the synthetic B and ceruloplasmin depletion connection you mention?
That’s a good point that synthetic B s lower potassium which you can increase by taking potassium. But how do you increase ceruloplasmin ? And thanks for mentioning copper. Otherwise people usually demonize copper. I use 2 to 4 mg of copper everyday and it helps with my headaches and energy etc. Potassium supplementation has helped me with controlling my appetite and loose weight and better sleep. B vitamins never help me increase energy whereas sulphur definitely helps.
Hi Focus Iridology,
I like getting my potassium too. It helps with staying on a diet and losing weight. But I was using just lots of leafy greens, while I am not consuming grains or taking supplements. But lately just eating all those organic leafy greens or thinking about them makes me a little nauseous. Either that is from a component in the plants or I have really caught up on any nutritional shorefalls. What is the amount and brand of potassium you take? Do you use one gentle on the stomach? I really had to back off on the organic greens I was eating. Best to listen to our bodies. Mine was saying, “please don’t feed me anymore of that for a while, I may barf.”
Also getting plenty of protein makes me feel the same way. I think I have addressed all deficiencies just by eating enough. Now I am trying to address getting enough sleep to become an even better fat burning machine. After a wonderful 8 hours or more of sleep, I break through weight loss plateaus every time, I have noticed. I think in the Bible, sleep is mentioned as “medicine” and for renewal. James Heriot in his wonderful books about being a veterinarian in Yorkshire mentions the curative power of sleep for extremely sick animals. Doctors in modern medicine will sometimes induce a coma to make an extremely ill patient recover from life threatening disease. So isn’t all of this pointing to a common source of illness, mental and physical, coming from sleep deprivation. I also read about bipolar disorder in Europe being treated by keeping the bipolar person awake through a certain number of sleep cycles, then letting them sleep for an extremely long time. How interesting. I don’t know if medicine was used to induce the sleep when they were allowed to sleep, but maybe some of you out there can do the research on that. They were resetting the people somehow with sleep and wake treatment. So we should all be looking at sleep as wonderful and restorative. A real win win for all of us and our kids too. Turning off our brains and our desire for entertainment at an early hour, will bring the cure that only Dreamland can promise.
Sweet dreams to all,
Jo
Hi Focus Iridology,
This is how to increase ceruloplasmin:
The focus needs to be on the livers production of Cp with the intent being to make the copper productive or bio-available.
Stop using hormone D supplements (yes hormone D is NOT a vitamin!) Hormone D kills liver vitamin A and Vit A is a critical precursor to Cp production
Stop calcium supplements that block copper absorption and copper is needed to make Cp
Take code liver oil (nordic naturals arctic orange flavor is best) to get D and A in the right ratios
Stop using ascorbic acid as it causes copper to separate from Cp
Take whole food Vit C (innate) to deliver the cofactors, tyrosinate and copper ions that the liver needs for Cp
Stop using iron supplements to solve so called “iron anemia” given that the research literature is clear that this is a clinical sign of copper deficiency and excess iron shuts off copper metabolism
Stop High fructose corn syrup which lowers liver copper and elevates liver iron
If you want to know more, search the magnesium advocacy group on FB
I hope this helps!
Mandi
Thanks for sharing here and being so willing to help but a quick reminder that we don’t offer direct feedback to someone here on the blog when we don’t know their entire health history.
I also really like to see links to research when statements like these are made – to make sure we are sharing research-based info and to help me and other blog readers learn if it’s something new we’re reading about. Much of this is new to me and I am curious. If there is no research just sharing that’s it’s clinical or anecdotal is fine too – but ideally with links to feedback/opinions from practitioners doing this work.
I was also taking a multivitamin and beef liver supplements. I couldn’t figure out why I was suffering all of a sudden with severe bloating, major gastrointestinal issues, restless legs and my arms, hands and legs were going numb and tingly all the time, especially at night. Plus, I was so tired all the time. Sleeping constantly, whenever possible, and it was like a comatose-type sleep.
The only new thing I had added in the past 6 months was the beef liver supplements (I’ve always taken a multivitamin). I stopped taking them and within days, all my symptoms starting improving.
1) I first started noticing minor strange sensations in the front part of my left foot about December 2017 to January 2018, numbness, stiffness, and feeling like I had a sock on when I didn’t. This has gradually increased through the months, and within this past month the same sensations have started in my right foot and some tingling in my hands.
2-3) No resolution of the problem, though I have further decreased my sugar and carbohydrates (even though tests show no sign of diabetes).
4-5) B6/Pyridoxine (25 mg. daily) as part of a B Vitamin complex advised by my alternative practitioner, started taking about August 2017.
Added another supplement for migraine reduction in March 2018, containing 10 mg. daily, and nerve support formula in May 2018, containing 4 mg. This is only 39 mg. (I had mistyped it as 99 mg. in my original comment.)
6) No known pyroluria, no zinc
7) None of the Rxs mentioned
Question: Do you advise taking gabapentin for peripheral neuropathy? I have heard it is only a “bandaid” to reduce pain (which I don’t yet have) and does nothing to reduce or reverse nerve damage, along with many side effects.
8) Too much EMF exposure from IT husband’s wireless internet setup and cordless phones. No cell phone use at all or smart meter.
9) Trying to increase eating organic and avoiding GMOs and plastics. No exposure to lawns, golf courses, or parks
10) No genetic testing yet to know polymorphisms
11) I was finally diagnosed last year with Hashimoto’s, which I have read can contribute to peripheral neuropathy, but I had been trying to get a diagnosis for 10 years without any previous sign of these symptoms. The WiFi, gyphosate, GMO, and plastic exposure had not changed (and are being reduced, all except WiFi, over which I have no say!) over the past several years, so, though possible, do not seem to be likely to have caused such a great change over just the past year. The only change I can see is the addition of this small daily amount of Vitamin B6.
Thanks again so much for providing this information with insights to possible causes for my symptoms.
Kathryn,
It has been documented in previous b6 toxicity studies that b6 toxicity is a possible cause for Hashi’s. The follow ups to the Dalton and Dalton study showed increased autoimmune issues in those who had b6 toxicity. Your entire history above screams issues with b6 and 99mg is not a small amount, despite what the above article states. You would be wise to have your b6 levels tested, drop those supplements, and allow your body to heal.
I did not take B6 (or a B complex supplement, only sublingual B12) until after my Hashimoto’s diagnosis. So, though taking it could have exacerbated any autoimmune conditions, I don’t think it could have been the original cause.
Kathryn
Thanks for sharing the additional feedback. I added a few more questions – magnesium, B complex, oxalates and thyroid health. With thyroid disease, whether or not it’s an autoimmune condition “peripheral diseases frequently include polyneuropathy” https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17344150
Please share where you have read about Hashimoto’s contributing to peripheral neuropathy.
I would seriously consider the role WiFi and EMFs could be playing. This paper, although not specific to neuropathy, illustrates the seriousness when someone is sensitive https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27355805
With reduced exposure to EMFs I’d also expect healing to be quicker. I write more here: Wi-Fi is an important threat to human health and may contribute to unresolved anxiety, SIBO, oxalate issues and high cortisol https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/wi-fi-threat-to-human-health-anxiety-sibo-oxalate-issues-high-cortisol/ Getting a meter is often a great way to convince skeptical husbands!
I have concerns about gabapentin because it has serious side-effects and can be very difficult to quit.
Trudy, I’m replying to your earlier comment above, here, because there was no ‘reply’ button next to that comment.
Above, you said: “I also really like to see links to research when statements like these are made – to make sure we are sharing research-based info and to help me and other blog readers learn if it’s something new we’re reading about. Much of this is new to me and I am curious. If there is no research just sharing that’s it’s clinical or anecdotal is fine too – but ideally with links to feedback/opinions from practitioners doing this work.”
I’d like that too. Please provide links to research — RESEARCH — not hypotheses or statements by government agencies — that show:
That pyroluria is a real, medical condition.
That “since B6 is water soluble, excesses are documented to be excreted via the urine so that toxic levels are never reached.”
My gawd, you have hundreds of people here, and there are hundreds of thousands around the world who know that even small doses of B6 can be toxic. You also know, and at least the literature backs it up — that B12 for example, builds up in the blood and tissues, despite it being a water soluble vitamin.
There are two main reasons that people develop neuropathy — often severe — from B6. It has to do with two other Bs, but I’ll wait for your reply.
I also hope you’ll edit the article above and delete the bits that state those extreme doses are not toxic.
Thank you.
It’s B6 toxicity. I had smaller amount than to, 10mg & less, not everyday. Began in 1 heel then 1 day couldn’t walk suddenly. RDV is a small 1.3mg-1.7mg. B6 I found googling has half-life of 33 days. Everyone has been taught to believe all b vids are water soluble & flush. They absorb. You’ve just accumulated toxicity. B6 has role with myelin nerve ends. Explainss the nerve damage I eead with roxicity. Was reading some people unable walk well for 1 yr. or longer. I walked klms I think that helped stimulate amaged nerves.
Hi Trudy,
Here from Amsterdam, I had 3 years ago a b6 -toxification after 1 year using vitamines and unfortunatly also wheatgrass together . I think I had that year 80/100 mg every day and from normal food all together.
Now 3 year later I feel better but there is still a litlle tingling in hands and feets especially after excercise.
I think you can be right , you mentioned some medicines , I ve used a lot of antibiotics in childhood.
Metabolism in stomach and intestines is very important.
Thank you for all your information and good work.
Annemiek
Thanks for contributing to the discussion and I’m sorry to hear you were impacted. Glad to hear you’re doing better. May I ask what your symptoms were 3 years ago? Was it just time or did you do something specific to detox?
Can you elaborate on the effect of wheatgrass with B6 please?
Thanks
Hello. I took a 4 days of b6 with 17mg, then few days after that I took a shot that included 50mg of b6. I’ve been taking gabapentin for 2 weeks prior to that, and now I have severe tingling and numbness. I noticed it when I got off gabapentin missed two doses and my tingles were not letting me sleep.
I had been taking different antibiotics before this and took metro (flagyl) just 3 pills of this.
I have not tested my b6 levels. I am not super petite but do weigh 130.
My B12 has always been tested & typically is always a bit high- 1083.
The tingling is back worse again. Seems like it worsened after I took my other weekly B’s, excluding B6 (indefinitely), on Monday. I also had experimented with a single dose (400 mcg of calcium folinic acid by designs for health) Sunday afternoon because I have C677T single MTHFR mutation & have done very poorly when trying other methyl folates/supplements, & it had an immediate negative reaction- yawning, difficulty breathing, anxious but fatigued & I haven’t felt right since & tingling is back worse so I am more suspect of this product than my weekly b’s I have taken for years (Paul Jaminet’s supplement protocol). I have had to learn the hard way that supplements are not benign & can have serious side effects. I’m sticking to the basics now & eliminating as many as possible. I will be extremely cautious with B vitamins & will not take B6 or any form of folate again. I’m done experimenting with supplements looking for that magic bullet that doesn’t exist. What works is a whole food paleo diet, low carb moderate-high fat, regular exposure to sunlight without sunglasses, exercise, good routines, social interaction/relationships & closeness with the Lord/prayer.
“Keep in mind that for most individuals, vitamin B6 causes no issues and is an important nutrient for improving the symptoms of pyroluria/social anxiety, reducing inflammation and oxidative stress, easing PMS and hormonal issues and much more. It also improves dream recall (which can be used to monitor vitamin B6 status).”
How can you make such a broad statement here? For many individuals, B6 will cause problems of which they don’t even realize the cause. The person will unknowingly continue taking the supplement because of uneducated statements like this found on the internet. Considering symptoms of B6 toxicity can vary so immensely from anxiety to burning mouth syndrome to full blown polyneuropathy, a statement like this above is both uneducated and dangerous to those who follow this blog. If you are still under the assumption that B6 is so harmless, then you need to do more research. Many other nutritionists have joined boards and dived into researching it because so many of their patients have issues with the supplement some even becoming toxic themselves. I don’t know how you could possibly be recommending it so often and not seeing issues with it unless you aren’t educated on the subject enough to see the problems associated with it.
Thanks for contributing to the discussion and I’m really sorry if you’ve been impacted by vitamin B6 toxicity.
I do feel comfortable making that statement because it’s backed up by both research and clinical evidence. There are SO many therapeutic benefits of vitamin B6 supplementation and I don’t want to frighten those who do so well with it. In this blog post I share many links to the research, much of which supports what I see clinically: Vitamin B6 improves dream recall (which can be used to monitor vitamin B6 status) https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/vitamin-b6-improves-dream-recall-which-can-be-used-to-monitor-vitamin-b6-status/
At the same time we do need to figure out why vitamin B6 is toxic for some. I’m readily admitting this issue of B6 toxicity is new to me and I’ve written this post in order to learn. I posed some questions for folks who have been affected in the hope I can learn more about why this may be happening and how we can help those affected.
I’ve been trying to think of a comparison and dietary oxalates come to mind. For a small subset of the population leafy greens like spinach and kale, nuts and seeds, eggplant, blueberries, raspberries, kiwi fruit, supplemental vitamin C and milk thistle (this list is far from conclusive) cause oxalates to build up in the body. Interestingly, they lead to some very similar symptoms as reported by those with vitamin B6 toxicity (burning, sharp “shards of glass” and hot-coals pain, numbness etc). Those who are affected by dietary oxalates need to eat low oxalate foods (and can use vitamin B6 and magnesium citrate or calcium citrate to counter the oxalate “toxicity”). But this doesn’t mean everyone needs to stop eating these medium and high oxalate foods which are nutrient-dense and healthy foods. I’m thinking the same rationale could be applied to vitamin B6 – some people have issues and others see benefits.
The big issue is not knowing who will be affected. I am very concerned about this. If you can point me to some forums and other practitioners writing about this I’d really appreciate that.
You may want to consider that the study showing vitamin C contributes to kidney stones was quite flawed.
http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v09n05.shtml
Humans do not make their own vitamin C, unlike almost all other mammals. It’s highly unlikely that it would cause harm in most cases.
Elaine
Thanks for this link. I am aware of this research but have also seen supplemental vitamin C have an adverse impact on many with dietary oxalate issues – increasing their pain and other symptoms – even when they do not have kidney stones. More here on Susan Owen’s site http://lowoxalate.info/index.html. Elsewhere on the site Susan Owens lists vitamin C as one nutrient to watch http://lowoxalate.info/supplements/supplements_neg.html
I would like to say I agree with Lisa who said:
“How can you make such a broad statement here? For many individuals, B6 will cause problems of which they don’t even realize the cause. The person will unknowingly continue taking the supplement because of uneducated statements like this found on the internet. Considering symptoms of B6 toxicity can vary so immensely from anxiety to burning mouth syndrome to full blown polyneuropathy, a statement like this above is both uneducated and dangerous to those who follow this blog. If you are still under the assumption that B6 is so harmless, then you need to do more research. Many other nutritionists have joined boards and dived into researching it because so many of their patients have issues with the supplement some even becoming toxic themselves. I don’t know how you could possibly be recommending it so often and not seeing issues with it unless you aren’t educated on the subject enough to see the problems associated with it.”
My personal story regarding pyridoxine poisoning goes like this:
I took a multivitamin containing 2mg of pyridoxine for a year and a half, followed by taking (in addition to the multivitamin) a Mega Vitamin B supplement containing 50mg of Pyridoxine in combination with a Magnesium supplement containing another 60mg of Pyridoxine, for 5 months. Two weeks after taking this additional 110 mg of pyridoxine I developed facial stabbing pains similar to trigeminal neuralgia, and 2 and a half months later optical migraines with aura. In addition I developed symptoms such as tingling sensations in my legs and arms, muscle twitches, brain fog, fatigue, anxiety (especially prior to the arrival of yet another optical migraine) and more.
I do not, and did not, take any other medication, I am very opposed to putting unnatural substances into my body. Learning what so-called healthy supplements can do to you have ensured that I will never ingest anything that comes out of a bottle or packet again. I am not exposed to Wifi or other sources of such radiation. I eat well, eat lots of whole grains and fruit and vegetables, not organic as it is too expensive, and walk everywhere. When I developed the above-mentioned symptoms I went to see a doctor who sent me off for a CT scan of my head (NAD) for the optical migraines, and who wanted to prescribe lyrica (which I refused to take), but he did not accept my belief that pyridoxine was a prime suspect of the cause of my problems. I kept records of all my symptoms and am convinced that my health problems were caused by the pyridoxine supplements, as the timeline totally fits.
Once I stopped taking any supplements, my optical migraines went away, this took 6 months. It is now a year since I stopped all supplements as mentioned above, and I still feel tired, have blurry vision, have some tingling on my lower legs, feeling dizzy at times, my walking is a bit unsteady, and I have feelings of being disconnected from my surroundings. I am still anxious when I wipe my face with a flannel due to the memory of the horrible pain stabs this triggered before. I am trying to help myself by focusing on eating well, drinking enough water, and getting my exercise, which is mainly walking. I have learned that approaching the medical profession with this issue is pointless.
I am lucky that I know how to conduct internet research and found out for myself that my symptoms could be caused by pyridoxine toxicity. The facebook forum on B6 toxicity was a godsend here. I would like to warn everyone out there to NOT take any Vit B6 supplements, as they are at risk of nerve damage from these artificial vitamins; at this point in time I am not even sure that my symptoms will ever go away.
I am also aware that not everyone is affected by this potential toxicity, a Dutch survey showed that about 18% of the population can be affected – but as food contains such good levels of Vitamin B6, supplementation should not be necessary, especially in the light that some of us can be so adversely affected by the synthetic pyridoxine form.
I attach a link to a publication which gives information on pyridoxine toxicity, ( see page 29 onwards) – from my point of view this is a very scientific approach which does not accept information other than from properly conducted statistical surveys. I hope that more surveys will be done soon. I also think that in time, pyridoxine toxicity will become more and more exposed, already it seems a well know fact that people can be damaged by drinking too many energy drinks, for example. To me it is telling that many countries are already lowering their upper tolerable levels of pyridoxine in supplements, food, and drinks.
https://www.efsa.europa.eu/sites/default/files/efsa_rep/blobserver_assets/ndatolerableuil.pdf
Other links that deal with this topic are :
https://cot.food.gov.uk/committee/committee-on-toxicity/cotstatements/cotstatementsyrs/cotstatements1997/vitb6tox
http://n.neurology.org/content/88/16_Supplement/P4.043
https://www.orthofyto.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/192123-Vitamin-B6-paradoxMisja-Vrolijk2017.pdf
https://www.efsa.europa.eu/sites/default/files/AF/170307/AF170307-p8_2.pdf
I really hope that my story will help someone out there, knowledge is power.
Joanna
Thanks for sharing your story and sorry to hear what you’ve been through. I’m glad to hear you’re doing better.
Thank you too for sharing these links. Here are some of my initial thoughts and feedback:
(1) “COT statement on vitamin B6 (pyridoxine) toxicity (June 1997)” https://cot.food.gov.uk/committee/committee-on-toxicity/cotstatements/cotstatementsyrs/cotstatements1997/vitb6tox
In the PDF there seem to be some inconsistencies stating:
“With the exception of the instances where especially high doses (in the order of grams) of this vitamin were ingested by some individuals, the signs of toxicity are reversible after cessation of ingestion.”
And then they conclude with this: “Allowing for a margin of safety between the lowest observed adverse effect level in humans and bearing in mind the supporting animal toxicity data, we recommend that the maximum daily intake of vitamin B6 from dietary supplements should be 10 mg per day.”
We also need to be aware that this comes from the British Food Standards Agency which we’d expect to have similar mainstream messaging that we’d expect by USA FDA i.e. very different from functional medicine/naturopathic/nutritional approaches.
(2) “Tolerable Upper Intake levels for Vitamins and Minerals” European Food Safety Authority https://www.efsa.europa.eu/sites/default/files/efsa_rep/blobserver_assets/ndatolerableuil.pdf
This is very comprehensive and I look forward to reading through all the research. As I’m sure you’ve read the upper limit for adults is 25mg vitamin B6 per day.
There are also some inconsistencies in this one too…”the data indicate that severe toxicity can be produced at doses of 500 mg/ day or more, and that minor neurological symptoms may be apparent at doses of 100 mg/day or more if consumed for long periods.
Neurotoxicity has not been reported at doses of 100 mg/day when consumed for a period of up to a few months but such data are not relevant to assessment of neurotoxicity, because of the slow development of symptoms at high doses and the inverse relationship between dosage and the onset of symptoms.”
It seems some of the studies may be too short to have shown neurotoxic effects if they were going to be seen in individuals and I do hope we see longer studies being done.
(3) ”A case of peripheral neuropathy due to pyridoxine toxicity in association with NOS energy drink consumption” http://n.neurology.org/content/88/16_Supplement/P4.043
At first glance I would question why the authors conclude it the vitamin B6 in the NOS energy drink given this also contains extremely high doses of caffeine (so high there is/was a class action lawsuit against the company https://www.schmidtlaw.com/nos-energy-lawsuit/), and also sucralose, yellow 5 and yellow 6 and a host of other nasty ingredients.
They do state: “Upon cessation and physical therapy, symptoms have improved.” I don’t know how much B6 he consumed, what form and how long it took for symptoms to resolve but as I dig more into this I plan to reach out to the study authors.
(4) “The vitamin B6 paradox: Supplementation with high concentrations of pyridoxine leads to decreased vitamin B6 function” https://www.orthofyto.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/192123-Vitamin-B6-paradoxMisja-Vrolijk2017.pdf
“the present study indicates that the neuropathy observed after taking a relatively high dose of vitamin B6 supplements is due to pyridoxine” however many people are reporting it’s both pyridoxine and P5P that are causing issues
The last sentence of the abstract states “symptoms of vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency” and is something we mustn’t forget in all this.
We know that B6 testing is controversial and high levels of vitamin B6 may not in fact indicate vitamin B6 toxicity
To help with my looking for patterns, if you don’t mind I’d like some clarification:
“I am not exposed to Wifi ” So you have ethernet cables when on the computer/the internet and don’t use a smart phone/iPhone or visit friends with computers or iPhones? Or have a smart meter in your home?
You mention “whole grains” – does this include gluten/wheat/rye, barley, oats?
Would you mind sharing what lead you to think it was B6 toxicity?
And did you rule out other possible root causes such as autoimmunity/hypothyroidism/Hashimoto’s, low B12, Lyme disease etc? Mayo Clinic lists many here https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/peripheral-neuropathy/symptoms-causes/syc-20352061
Please also see my response to Lisa and let’s leave the insults out of this discussion. I can see why you and Lisa feel so strongly about this so we’re all good 🙂
I’m doing my best to learn and try and help figure this out but as you can imagine it’s very time-consuming. Also If I was to say no-one should ever use vitamin B6/P5P I’d be doing a disservice to everyone who sees immense benefits. This blog post is my way of trying to help people like you who feel they have been harmed by vitamin B6.
Joanna,
My experiences matched yours precisely. You mentioned burning mouth syndrome…….one of the most debilitating condition I endured. I suffered so greatly, I didn’t want to go on.
After seeing multiple physicians and specialists, a Neurologist thought to have my b6 level tested……..in the 90s with 21 as the upper limit. Finally, after suffering for over 9 months, I had an answer.
Please, all physicians out there include b6 level testing!!!!
Jan
Thanks for sharing. I hope you’re doing better. May I ask if you’re seeing symptom resolution as your B6 levels go down?
In case you still have some burning mouth symptoms – there are many possible root causes and GABA can often help https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/gaba-oral-rinse-reduces-burning-mouth-pain/
Joanna, thank you for sharing. I recently was diagnosed with B6 toxicity and my symptoms are very similar to yours (Burning sensation in my head, face, neck and extremities, numbness in my fingers and feet, blurred vision, facial pain, tremor, fatigue, stiff neck and fingers, heat and cold sensitivity) I have had symptoms for the past 3 months on a daily basis. After a long neurologic work up to rule out MS and months of being terrified with no answers. Now knowing the cause of my symptoms and that there’s other people that I can relate to bring me some comfort knowing I’m not alone. I hope that since your post you are doing much better.
Did you ever try Alphalipoic Acid? It’s supposed to help heal nerve damage. It seemed to help me! Did I see that Vitamin C can also cause issues to crop up after B6 toxicity? I am having some sort of reaction to SOMETHING, but I don’t know what. I am not taking anything with B6. Have you ever read anything about sugar substitutes causing issues?
Agree with Lisa here. I took about three gummy multivitamins over the course of several days, each containing 1.5mg B6. This is not a typo! I switched to a separate B complex after symptoms began and only took maybe three tabs total, again over the course of several days, each containing 2mg. So in all, I had about 10.5mg B6 in the span of two weeks and got vitamin B6 toxicity! Complicating matters further is that, for me at least, magnesium exaserbates B6 toxicity symptoms, and it almost sent me to the ER with heart pounding til I finally put the pieces together. The conundrum: I am very magnesium deficient. How can I bring magnesium up without causing further B6 toxicity! Oh, this is such a nightmare!
Kate, what did you do in your situation? How long did it take for the toxicity to go away and you could begin to take magnesium again? Clearly b6 is toxic at even small doses. It is unbelievable this isn’t more known.
Hi Trudy.
I also have been exploring why some people develop B6 Toxicity even from small doses. My Facebook page ‘Autism Redefined’ explains a new hypothesis that I have been developing that in a small percentage of the population, perhaps 10-20% of people have altered genetics to helps them store for famines and a higher inflammatory response to defend against pathogens and any perceived threaths.
I call these people ‘High Inflammation /Famine Storage types or Born Hunters. I have written an informative article called ‘The B6 Confusion, are High Inflammation People high or Low in B6 & what causes B6 Toxicity?’ which you can access here https://www.facebook.com/epigenetics.epiphany/posts/359703154497934?__tn__=K-R.
I believe that altered genetics combined with increased availability of B6 cause some to over store B6 in numerous converted forms, including, sulfatide in their muscles. This sulfatide can be reconverted to B6 when the person’s body signals famine or detox and is used to power the body until food is available again. In our modern society where excess B6 and lack of famine or detox occur, in this 10-20% of people their bodies reach maximum storage capacity and have to release some of the storage. This release is seen in the symptoms of B6 toxicity.
Depending, on each individuals combined genetic snps they have varying storage levels and some reach toxic levels faster, some slower. My next short video has a collection of 20 genetic snps which contribute to B6 toxicity and other inflammatory diseases. The higher the amount of the genetic snps a person has combined the more risk for B6 toxicity the person may have. I hope my work can be used to help identify the people most at risk of over storage and inflammation so this 1:20 people can be treated appropriately.
Michaela
Thank you for sharing your hypothesis and related research on ‘High Inflammation /Famine Storage types or Born Hunter’ types and the connection to why some people develop B6 Toxicity even from small doses. This is fascinating! It’s very interesting seeing the oxalate and alkaline phosphatase connections and I look forward to diving deeper in to this and learning more.
I have a few questions right away – where the 10-20% number comes from? is it your hypothesis that these 10-20% meet all the critera you write about and all have issues with B6 toxicity? do you have an article for the lay person listing lab markers, genes/SNPs and other factors (like oxalate issues) that individuals with B6 toxicity can review and check off/rule out? and a link to your hypothesis for a solution or is that a work in progress?
You also mention a video in the comment and a few videos in the facebook post – feel free to share links to those here too
Hi Trudy,
Thank you for your reply. Here are two links to my video’s about ‘High Inflammation /Famine Storage Genetic Types’.
https://www.facebook.com/epigenetics.epiphany/videos/340509413083975/
https://www.facebook.com/epigenetics.epiphany/videos/400554950412754/
I started my research 20 years ago and am a member of numerous Facebook groups, including, B6 Toxicity, Autism Recovery, Trying Low Oxalates, CBS Gene, MTHFR, Non Secretors, Mast Cell Activation and more. I have identified similar symptoms through out these groups, even where they develop different diseases. I was fascinated that a person with B6 Toxicity could have such similar symptoms and gene snps to a child with Autism.
As I started to try to identify the combined altered gene snps that could be contributing to neuropathy, B6 Toxicity, fatigue, ASD, ADHD and more I found that many in these groups also had similar ancestry, Northern European, Irish, Scottish, German, Dutch, and Scandinavian. I also noticed that in many of the past scientific paper, a small subset, didn’t improve, or in fact, deteriorated with supplements to push detox and methylation. I discovered these often had MTHFR, and CBS upregulations and were often Non-Secretors of the FUT2 gene enzymes. Also their bodies usually had a high Cysteine:sulfate ratio. The research I studied across numerous inflammatory diseases mentioned an approx 1: 5, 1:10 and 1:20 ratio looking at different gene snps. For example research by Peter D’Adamo mentions approx 20% of people are Non Secretors.
I kept looking for connections in altered gene snps and symptoms and through my research into the upregulated CBS gene, I found the answer to some of my biggest questions. People with altered sulfuration paths seemed to be becoming more toxic when they added supplements that would usually detox or calm others, such as, glutathione, B6 and sulfate. I wondered why the body or Nature would benefit from this increased toxicity. Then it came to me, that Nature was trying to slow the person down, and it was through a unique set of adapted genes that could push the person into a hibernation type state. I believe this state is to allow time for them to detox. I have come to the conclusion that people with neuropathy and B6 Toxicity have increased genetics for famine survival and storage of B6 and other metabolites, such as, sulfatide, iron, copper, oxalates and toxins, such as, heavy metals. They also have an increased inflammatory response to fight pathogens, which would have been beneficial pre antibiotics.
Unfortunately, modern changes which increase, early inflammation, stress, heavy metals. glyphosate, oxalates, sugars, mega vitamins and iron are all combining to overload babies early, and I hypothesise push them into initially, a fight or flight continuous stress response, which wastes their cortisol and calming nutrients, as many also have genetics for pyroluria, and reduced ability to absorb B vitamins into the cells. This co-incides with their Non Secretor status, which reduced their ability for N-linked glycosylation, which is where a sugar is attached to a protein and this in turn prevents them from using B vitamins efficiently and also suppresses their immune system. A lowered immune system allows in more pathogens, which, I hypothesise in my videos, create further inflammation to burst open the over stored cells, to release the overload.
We see the same inflammatory process in adults with similar genetics to children with ASD, but they take longer to enter a hibernation like reduced metabolic state, including, reduced thyroid function. When they do pass their genetic limit for toxins, this is when B6 toxicity, neuropathy, Hashimoto’s disease, chronic Fatigue, oxalates issues, mast cell activation and histamine issue occur. I see the symptoms as the body trying to slow further entry of toxins and nutrients and allowing the over storage to be released. I think if truly in hibernation, the heat from neuropathy would have been beneficial in colder Northern winters to keep the person alive.
If you have time, I would be happy to chat with you on Skype about this hypothesis. I have been fortunate to meet many amazing people and 20 with numerous inflammatory disease symptoms, including, B6 Toxicity and Autism, have allowed me access to their full 23andme genetic data. From this I have been able to bring my hypothesis to life and have found strikingly similar altered genes across all the data. I am just finishing my 5th Autism Redefined video that details 20 of these genetic snps. Overall, I have focused on 50 genetic snps and depending, on each person’s combination of snps, they can be a ‘High Inflammation / Famine Storage Types’ but develop one or more of numerous inflammatory diseases. I ask people with inflammatory diseases to check their 23andme data to see if they have these snps. This video would be close to what you asked is available for lay people to use, to compare the altered snps I detail, included, ones that increase inflammation, storage, and can reduce methylation and detox abilities when stressed, against their inflammatory symptoms, including, B6 Toxicity.
My hope is to create a list of the genes that are high risk for increased storage and inflammation and thus identify babies at birth with a high percentage of these combined genes. Thus, we can take preventative steps to avoid the inflammatory diseases ever starting. I am composing a ‘Return to Nature plan’ with steps that identified people could take to reduce their risks for inflammation and over storage and also help to detox and re balance people who have already passed their ‘Genetic Limit’ and these will be part of my final video.
If I have even a small dose of B6 over a few days, my fingers start to go numb. I have challenged this off and on about 10 times with the same result. I have one MTHFR mutation.
Kelly
Thanks for sharing. Would you mind sharing if it’s pyridoxine or P5P and how much? And if the numbness does away when you stop? Have you looked into dietary oxalates and possibility this may be related to oxalate dumping? More on oxalates here http://lowoxalate.info/index.html
Feel free to also answer the other questions posed
I do not have personal experience as I do not consume it exclusively. However I hear of medical practioners recommending P5P over B6 and hence wanted to seek your opinion regarding it.
Beng
I have found that many of my clients who need vitamin B6, do very well with vitamin B6/pyridoxine and yet some people do better with P5P/ pyridoxal 5-phosphate (which is the activated form) because they lack the enzyme needed to convert pyridoxine to P5P. P5P is also more pricey so we typically start clients on vitamin B6 and monitor their symptoms like anxiety, social anxiety, PMS, morning nausea/breakfast aversion, being sensitive to supps/med, and also their dream recall. And then, if needed, have them switch to P5P or sometimes a combination of both.
My story is long and complex – I started having horrible nerve pain and subsequent postural orthostatic tachycardia. I ate really clean, had energy drinks though, and finally liquid iv. The week I started liquid iv, (nurse) felt like I was probably dehydrated at work, all hell broke loose. I would have rapid heart rates after I drank it, started correlating it, my hands were going numb, I had night sweats. I thought maybe I was b12 deficient, started taking b12, had my b12/d checked, things kept getting worse with all my tests unremarkable, I had started an organic Whole Food sourced multivitamin at this time, was not drinking liquid or energy drinks anymore because of the tachycardia. The vitamin had 10mg food sourced pyrodoxine, by June I was numb everywhere, impaired vibration sense, saw two different neurologists, mris were normal, although I stopped sweating and was losing dexterity in my hands, couldn’t feel temperature, MS workup was negative. I thought I was dying and kept getting prescribed anxiety meds. I took a benzo (klonopin) reluctantly for about a month and also tried a SSRI, but I knew I wasn’t going crazy, something was so wrong. I paid for my B6 to be tested and it was 3 times upper limit 7 weeks after stopping the vitamin. Things progressively got worse over those 7 weeks. I also found out I had EBV reactivation, but I now feel like it was likely secondary to the hell and stress of progressive neuropathy and no one could tell me why. Who knows? I am about 10 months out and I still have issues I pray are resolved with time.
hi! i get your newsletter (love your work!) and was shocked to see this title as i had been searching theninternet for vitamin b toxicity and not coming up with much. i got a vitamin b shot (not sure exactly which b’s) a couple months ago and went into my worst chronic farique episode ever. it lasted about 10 days and then i finally started feeling better. however i also flew the following day from california to chicago which always makes me tired-whether it be from emfs and flying and/or time change. however, i recalled that i had one other vitamin b shot about a year ago and had similar effect. answers to your questions: i habe never taken benzodiazepines , although possible ive been exposed in the last year that i stopped using R.O water. i use cell phone regularly but house is pretty clean from emfs. dont eat gmos and other supplements havent caused me to feel this way. thanks for doing this research, very curious.
Alison
Thanks for your kind words. Vitamin B12 shots are more common that vitamin B6 shots so it’s likely to have been B12. Some people react to the form of B12 so I encourage my clients to find out the details and keep a list of adverse effects from what they’ve trialed or been prescribed/recommended
also, how do you know if benzodiazepines are in your water?
Alison
I don’t know if there is a way to test this commercially but it’s a very real issue https://www.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/features/drugs-in-our-drinking-water#1
You should join the exploring B-6 toxicity group on Facebook…over 1.3K members with a lot of info on toxicity and what led to their diagnosis. Below are my answers to your questions.
What were/are your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues?
I woke up one night feeling like my feet were burning, but they weren’t hot to touch. That feeling migrated to my arms and face. I also super had low energy and brain fog. About a week into this, I went to the doctor and my levels were 257 (almost double what they should be). I’m still experiencing these symptoms but a little less. It has been 3.5 months since I stopped taking supplements.
Have you resolved the symptoms and if yes how?
Did you make any other changes around the same time i.e. stopping and/or other nutritional support?
Not totally and I am 3.5 months post diagnosis. I just did a 21 day purification cleanse and I started to feel much better, but when I reintroduced caffeine, my burning legs and arms came back. I have heard from other testimonies that it can take 2 years to feel relief 🙁
Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking?
Not sure, the supplements I was taking had both.
And how much did you take and how often?
80-200 mg/ day (80 mg was methylated b complex) daily for 2 months….Plus what I was getting naturally from food.
Past history or current use of medications like benzodiazepines (such as Ativan, Xanax, valium etc.), gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP / birth control pill, SSRIs /antidepressants (such as Prozac, Celexa, Lexapro, Paxil, Zoloft etc.), fluroquinolone antibiotics (such as ciprofloxacin/Cipro, gemifloxacin/Factive, levofloxacin/Levaquin, moxifloxacin/Avelox, norfloxacin/Noroxin and ofloxacin/Floxin), PPIs (proton pump inhibitors such as Nexium for heart-burn), diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc.?
None.
What kind of EMF exposure do you have – WiFi in the home and/or at work, how much cell phone use in a day, cordless phones at home and/or work and a smart meter at home?
WiFi at home and at work. I talk on my iPhone once or twice a day, but use it throughout the day to check email and other apps.
What kind of exposure have you had to GMOs and pesticides (i.e. do you only eat organic food), glyphosate (eg. Roundup exposure from lawns, golf courses, parks etc.), plastics/phthalates (do you avoid plastics)?
I eat 100% organic . I’m sure I have exposure to glgphosate, but I don’t use that at my house. I use glass/Pyrex, silicone, and stainless steel containers, and if I do use plastic I use bpa free and never put in dishwasher.
What polymorphisms do you have: cytochrome P450 polymorphisms (we know some of these make benzodiazepines more toxic and more difficult to taper in about 60% of those prescribed these meds), and/or MTHFR polymorphism (may affect our detox ability if it’s expressing) and others you know about?
I just got tested for MTHFR but haven’t received results back yet. I posed this question on a fb group and asked if anyone who tested for MTHFR were negative and there were, so I’m not convinced B-6 toxicity is related to MTHFR.
Mollie
Thanks for contributing to the discussion and sharing. Sorry to hear about your issues. Glad to hear you’re doing better. Would you mind sharing what your 21 day purification cleanse looked like? What caffeine-containing drink did you reintroduce that led to burning legs and arms?
As I mentioned to Kathryn I would seriously consider the role WiFi and EMFs could be playing. This paper, although not specific to neuropathy, illustrates the seriousness when someone is sensitive https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27355805
With reduced exposure to EMFs I’d also expect healing to be quicker. I write more here: Wi-Fi is an important threat to human health and may contribute to unresolved anxiety, SIBO, oxalate issues and high cortisol https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/wi-fi-threat-to-human-health-anxiety-sibo-oxalate-issues-high-cortisol/ Turning off WiFi in the home at night is a first step. When using the iPhone during the day, keeping it arm’s length and away from the body is best and switching it to 3G helps too.
Correct – some folks with issues have a MTFR polymorphism and some don’t but if it’s present and expressing we could expect detox to be compromised so added detox support may help.
I am aware of the exploring B-6 toxicity group on Facebook – thanks!
Thanks for the info. I did the Standard Process 21 Day Purification program.
Here’s some info on it:
https://www.standardprocess.com/Standard-Process/Purification-Program/About
https://www.standardprocess.com/Products/Literature/Patient-Purification-Program-Guide
Caffeinated coffee is what I drank and reacted to (approximately 10 Oz). I will definitely take your advice about the wifi at night, and keeping my phone at arms distance or more during the day. I also think alcohol triggers flare ups for me. I have experienced this with 2 glasses of wine.
I think I have Vitamin B-6 Toxicity. My feet, ankles, arms, and shoulder are burning. My neurologist dismissed me on my idea that I have B6 toxicity. Y blood test results showed my level is at 41 and the normal is 21. She said the level has to reach 100 before it considers as toxic
I am very petite. I am 4’11” and weigh 90 lbs. I know my body pretty well, I workout daily. I started to have this burning sensations almost 3 weeks ago. It kept me out of work a couple of days a week when the burning was so bad. There’s not a pair of shoes that don’t make my feet burn.
A year ago I had Trigeminal Neuralgia and the neurologist put me on 1200 MG of gabapentin. The TN is content and I was just about to taper down the doses of gabapentin but this condition emerged and my neurologist add another 100 mg of gabapentin and now I am on 1300 mg of gabapentin and it does not help with my neuropathy pain. I am still searching for a doctor who could help me to reduce this debilitating pain on my feet.
I took 40 mg of Vitamin B6 phosphate for the past 6 months. My chiropractor told me B6 is a good vitamin to take to improve neurological condition. I shouldn’t have listened to him.
I also take 400 mg of magnesium for the past 7 years. The magnesium has never caused any problems all these years.
Anyone has any tips how to detox B6? Any information regarding how to manage or reduce the burning pain will be greatly appreciated. I feel like I am at the end of my rope. I thought about hurting myself. I am in the process to see a counselor to help me get through this. Please help.
I’d like to join the vitamin B6 toxicity support group. Can someone give me the website address?
Thank you much
1, 4, 5) In summer of 2014, I changed my multi-vitamin from the brand I had been taking for years to a “Women’s 50+” (different brand). The new daily multi-vitamin contained 25mg of synthetic B6 (pyroxidine). By October of 2014, I was experience “stockings and gloves” tingling in my hands, lower arms, feet and calves. I went to my family doctor who did some minimal blood work (including B12, but not B6). Nothing came up so she told me “not to worry”.
By February/March of 2015, I had developed a number of symptoms — including “internal trembling sensations” (i.e., these couldn’t be felt externally, but internally, it felt as though someone had turned on a very strong vibrator). These symptoms occurred in my arms, legs, chest, head and face. They could occur at any time, though they were worse at night — and could wake me up from a sound sleep with a sensation of being violently shaken. I had insomnia (sleeping 3-4 hours per night), severe anxiety, brain fog, muscle pain. I went back to my doctor — no further testing, but a prescription for anti-depressants — which I ultimately refused because I was certain there was an underlying physical cause. I also went to a neurologist who said that my symptoms “didn’t sound like a major neurological disease” but who told me to come back in a month if they persisted. When I returned in a month, he was frankly somewhat irritated. Finally, my chiropractor referred me to a physiatrist (physician specializing in interaction of nerve, muscle, bone). She listened to my symptoms and ordered blood work (including B6). My B6 level came back at 113 on a normal scale of 2 – 21.
2, 3) I immediately stopped the multivitamin (I still don’t take a multi as it is impossible to find one without B6). I had already started acupuncture which was enormously helpful with the anxiety element of the B6 toxicity and I continued this. I made sure to drink plenty of water. I never eat processed foods, but for many months, I had to restrict or eliminate some high B6 foods (e.g., avocado) as they seemed to exacerbate physical symptoms.
It took approximately 2 1/2 years until I recovered from most of the nerve damage. I can still get mild symptoms (e.g., internal vibrations in my calves) if I am dehydrated, tired or stressed.
7) I take no other medications (never have) — though I continue to take vitamin B6, fish oil, sesame seed oil, probiotics and digestive enzymes. I eat primarily organic food and I try to eat 8+ servings of fruits and vegetables each day.
Had B6 levels been checked for when I first exhibited symptoms, I would have been spared the worst year of my life to date — and recovery would have been much quicker.
D. Ann
Thanks for contributing to the discussion and sharing your experiences. I’m sorry to hear what you went through. Glad to hear acupuncture helped with the anxiety aspect.
I’m curious which multi-vitamin brand you took before starting on the Women’s 50+ and who makes the Women’s 50+? I wonder if the vitamin B6 was in some way different and the dosage difference was a possible factor?
I see your correction – I continue to take vitamin D, fish oil, sesame seed oil, probiotics and digestive enzymes
Desert Harvest has a B complex that doesn’t contain vitamin B6 https://www.desertharvest.com/shop-new/B-Complex-without-B6-90-capsules.html
Thank you for the response — and I’m glad to see that you are looking at this issue.
I’ve actually just started to take the Desert Harvest complex (though only twice per week at this point — I’m now a bit cautious :)).
For years, I used a Nature’s Plus adult chewable multi-vitamin without any issues. They discontinued the flavor that I had been using, and so I switched to the 50+. The vitamin I switched to was a Rainbow Lite product. At the time that I took the Rainbow Lite 50+, it contained 25 mg of synthetic B6. I looked it up before responding here and I see that it now contains just 15 mg of B6. I later switched to a Pure Encapsulations multi-vitamin (Nutrient 950 without iron) prior to diagnosis on the advice of a naturopath — but I saw the naturopath after developing symptoms — so the Pure Encapsulations product was not the source of the original issue.
I continue to be amazed that a multivitamin could have been the cause of so many physical symptoms and so much stress — but I have clear personal evidence that this was the case. I also have a new appreciation for the human nervous system …
Totally Agree ! I went through this same process !
1. What were/are your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues?
I started taking a supplement called Circuplex, by Standard Process. It was recommended by my chiropractor to help with bruising issues in my hands. I used to bust blood vessels regularly and extreme pressure not always necessary. It worked, too. One Circuplex cap had 4.7mg of pyridoxine, 240% of the RDA, and I had 2 caps per day – not even a therapeutic dose by your reckoning.
Sometime in the first year that I started taking them, I developed migraines. I was at an age where onset of migraine is not uncommon, and I have Ehlers Danlos Syndrome (thus the bruising), so the migraines were explained away by those two things.
I continued supplementing for almost 15 years. I developed asthma, my existing nystagmus worsened. I developed tinnitus, tremor, pre-ventricular contractions (to a noticeable level – often food-triggered), extreme photophobia, inability to correct my vision, Raynaud’s like symptoms in my hands – slightest cold, my fingers would go numb, and not return for hours, even after warming.
I never had tingling neuropathy.
I was not diagnosed until I had significant nerve symptoms in my face. Medical team was freaked out at possibility of stroke or Bell’s Palsy. I firmly believe it was B6. MRI negative, I was finally sent to neurologist. He tested for at least 16 things. The only abnormal blood test was B6, at nearly three times the top of the range.
2. Have you resolved the symptoms and if yes how?
I stopped supplementing. I didn’t know that all those symptoms listed were B6 – until they went away. It took two years for most to get better and nearly three years for my eyes to improve. I reduced high B6 foods in my diet for the first two years. My blood level then tested low, so I increased portions of meat, and added back in chicken/turkey, nuts, avocados.
3. Did you make any other changes around the same time i.e. stopping and/or other nutritional support?
I did not. I take a supplement protocol for my Ehlers Danlos and I continued that.
4. Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking?
Pyroxidine was added to several supplements I was taking.
5. And how much did you take and how often?
At my highest supplementation, I was taking about 100mg per day, that’s about 4000% of the RDA. I was taking Circuplex, a B complex, and an amino acid that had pyridoxine added.
6. If you have pyroluria were you also taking zinc and how much?
Everyone releases pyrroles, it’s not a disease. No, I don’t have it. I took zinc from time to time, but not consistently, and no it didn’t make a difference.
7. Past history or current use of certain medications like benzodiazepines, gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP, SSRIs, fluroquinolone antibiotics, PPIs, diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc.? (If you have not used the above medications have you been exposed to them via drinking water?)
I take the very rare valium for an MRI or CT scan, but I have never taken benzos regularly. I have been given gaba or Neurontin pre bone surgery, but I have never taken them regulary. I don’t believe I’ve had fluoroquinolones, and I rarely take antibiotics. I have taken too many NSAIDS in my life. None of those others.
8. Our increased EMF exposure – WiFi, cell phones, cordless phone and smart meters?
I did not have a cell phone until long after they were popular, and then ubiquitous. Smart meters didn’t come to my house until long after I’d stopped being toxic.
9. Our increased exposure to GMOs, glyphosate, plastics/phthalates, pesticides etc.?
Unlikely. I’m cleaner than most, as I have had pain from Ehlers Danlos for much longer than toxicity.
10. Interactions with all of the above and/or certain polymorphisms – we know *cytochrome P450* polymorphisms make benzodiazepines more toxic and more difficult to taper in about 60% of those prescribed benzodiazepines
Many EDS patients have P450 challenges. But it’s also that because our collagen is more like wicker than woven fabric, stuff passes through more quickly. Many patients with EDS cannot get effectively numb from anesthesia at the dentist. I am not one of those – though it may pass through me slightly more quickly than another woman of comparable size to me.
I too had issues with my fingers in the cold while taking B6. I walk regularly in the evening with a friend — including through most of the winter months. My fingers became quite painful in the cold even with double layers of gloves/mittens. I didn’t realize that it was B6 related until I stopped taking B6 and began to recover from the nerve damage.
Elaine
Gosh I’m reading through everyone’s comments and see I somehow missed your feedback – my apologies! Thanks for sharing and so glad you’re doing better.
To help me try and connect the dots and see patterns
– what made you connect your symptoms to possible B6 toxicity ? Was it your “abnormal blood test was B6, at nearly three times the top of the range”? Did he/she test plasma B6 and what was the range and your level?
– many of your symptoms sound a lot like low B12. May I ask if your neurologist tested B12, MMA and homocysteine?
– and did he/she look for other root causes of your facial nerve symptoms https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/peripheral-neuropathy/symptoms-causes/syc-20352061
And correct, everyone releases pyrroles but some folks more than others, hence the symptoms of pyroluria. You may be interested to read this blog on EDS and pyroluria https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/joint-hypermobility-ehlers-danlos-syndrome-pyroluria/
Update — A correction to my own post — correct my statement to “I continue to take vitamin D” — I will never take B6 again!
New #11: I was taking a B complex supplement containing 25 mg. Pyridoxine, then added a migraine-preventative supplement containing an additional 10 mg.
12) I was taking a magnesium supplement containing 150 mg., now taking one with 400 mg.
13) I have been trying to avoid oxalates in foods for almost 2 years after having a kidney stone in December 2016. So I haven’t veen having enough foods high in oxalates to ve able to tell whether they would adversely affect my peripheral neuropathy.
14-15) Yes, I have been diagnosed with Hashimoto’s because of elevated thyroid antibodies.
Trudy, you requested that I share my source of information that Hashimoto’s could contribute to peripheral neuropathy. I read on the Mayo Clinic web site page for Peripheral Neuropathy that low thyroid (not specifically Hashimoto’s) could be a possible cause of peripheral neuropathy.
Hi Trudi,
First of all its great to see that you are reaching out to find out about the toxic effects of this vitamin which had huge effect on my family. My 65 year old mum was suffering from high blood pressure and high homocysteine and started self- medicating with 200 mg of vit B6 daily to lower her homocysteine levels. She was not on any pressure lowering tablets as she has always been sceptical when it comes to prescribed drugs. She started the protocol in September 2017. In Novemebr she started expieriencing tingling in her fingers and toes. She struggled doing her job (dentist) started dropping things. Her speech became tremling as if she was about to cry and she was crying uncontrollably and became extremely emotional. She immediately stopped the vitamin as after doinf some research she found out this may be due to vit b6. Sadly things have gone progressively worse for my mum; the tingling was followed by spells if dizziness, her legs slowly became weaker and weaker and atm she is no longer able to walk unaided wothout a walker. Getting up is a struggle; lifting herself up etc. she also expierienced tounle breathing and swallowing but fortunately this is now improving. She spent 6 weeks in a neuro ward followed by intense physiotherapy and speech therapy. Her speech improved and is no longer trembling unles she is very tired but there is no improvment with her motoring functions. My mum has always been a very strong woman but I would say shes always been bery stressed and being a dentist has been exposed to breathing toxins when polishing fillings etc as well as breathing desinfectants etc. I belive her nerves may have already been damaged and it was the vit b6 which ‘broke the camls back’. Please feel free to reach out i will be happy to provide further information.
Annouska
Gosh it seems I missed a bunch of comments and yours was one of them – my apologies! I’m so sorry to hear about your mum.
To help me try and connect the dots and see patterns
– what made you and her connect your symptoms to possible B6 toxicity ? Did she test plasma B6 and what was the range and her level?
– many of her symptoms sound a lot like low B12. May I ask if she has had tested B12, MMA and homocysteine tests?
– and has her doctor looked for other root causes of her symptoms – tingling fingers and toes/neuropathy has a number of possible causes including low B6. metals, Lyme disease, diabetes etc. This Mayo Clinic article lists many https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/peripheral-neuropathy/symptoms-causes/syc-20352061
Hello Trudy,
I recently read this paper, which you might find it an interesting read with regard to B6 toxicity. The overview is below. As a nutritionist, I had an ongoing argument with a friend (also a nutritionist) who claimed B6 could be toxic even at low doses. I didn’t give the idea much credit but then read this paper and thought there might be something to it particularly with regard to pyridoxine inhibiting the active form P5P. Those with higher needs (genetics, biological demands etc) could be more susceptible to these effects?
The vitamin B6 paradox: Supplementation with high concentrations of pyridoxine leads to decreased vitamin B6 function.
Highlights:
• Pyridoxine is the toxic form of vitamin B6.
• Neuronal cells are sensitive to the toxic effects of pyridoxine.
• The inactive form PN competitively inhibits the active PLP.
• Symptoms of vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency.
Link to the paper: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0887233317301959
Amanda
Thanks for contributing and this link. I’m familiar with this paper but have some questions with the conclusions simply because some folks report vitamin B6 to be an issue and some report P5P to be an issue. Likewise many do really well with either vitamin B6 or P5P.
I look forward to a follow-on study that confirms or disproves these in vitro/test-tube results and because of the above statement I wonder what the findings will be. But as you say this may well be the situation…”Those with higher needs (genetics, biological demands etc) could be more susceptible to these effects?” Figuring out this aspect may take longer.
I do agree that symptoms of too much vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency and some practitioners are proposing that it’s really vitamin B6 deficiency that is the cause of peripheral neuropathy (and other symptoms) that many individuals are reporting. I’ve come across some autism/vitamin B6 studies that allude to this and discuss some additional tests
They report that the “finding of high vitamin B(6) levels is consistent with recent reports of low levels of pyridoxal-5-phosphate and low activity of pyridoxal kinase (i.e., pyridoxal is only poorly converted to pyridoxal-5-phosphate, the enzymatically active form). This may explain the functional need for high-dose vitamin B(6) supplementation in many children and adults with autism.” This is in study from 2004 – Pilot study of a moderate dose multivitamin/mineral supplement for children with autistic spectrum disorder https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15673999. And is expanded upon in some of their later studies too.
I believe the markers are plasma vitamin B6, RBC pyridoxal-5-phosphate and the enzyme pyridoxal kinase.
I clearly have much to learn about this and I’ll be doing more digging and reading.
Hi Trudy,
Firstly thanks for your great newsletters and summits, I’m an avid reader/watcher. I’m also a naturopath plus have pyrrole (or maybe I should say had pyrrole, as I feel my levels are much better now). I also host the Face Book page called Pyrrole Australia and would love to share your post/info with them too, (with your permission) and felt to write to you about B6 toxicity personally and with clients I have seen as I do feel that it really does exist.
Over the past several years I have been treating people with pyrrole disorder, various methylation defects among other things and it seems in my corner of the world at least (QLD, Australia) that B6 toxicity is very real. I have treated many clients who have been treated with high doses of B6 mostly by integrative doctors (often 200mg 2-3 times per day and sometimes 500mg x2) and they have had terrible issues from being on high doses.
One of my personal worst experiences with B6 was when I was going through menopause and went to an integrative GP who picked up that I had pyrrole among other issues and she put me on 200mg of B6/day (150mg Pyridoxine and 50mg P5P) and I got severe anxiety over nothing at all, something I had never experienced before this time (except with exams and getting married etc, just normal anxiety) but this was ridiculous. Ok so that wasn’t toxicity related but still crazy and the dose was too high for my body.
I already knew I had issues with B6 from previous experiences so had until this time only been taking 25mg within a magnesium formula that I seemed to tolerate quite well. I had been on this product (CalmX by Metagenics) for a few years actually and then one day I started to get numb fingers, that then seemed to spread to my toes and then my lips and was getting pins and needles, headaches and sparkles in my eyes like electricity. I got tested (after few days off sups) and my B6 level was in the thousands. Wow!
It seemed I was getting nerve damage from the B6. It took 9 months of being off all B6 for my levels to fall within range and for the numbness etc to stop. This was all years prior to the high dose B6 the integrative GP gave me. So when she prescribed this dose I told her of my previous experience and she brushed it off and said to ride through any symptoms. Within a week along with extreme anxiety I had all the nerve stuff back again.
I had to go off her prescription of B6 for 2 years to recover that time and the numbness in my toes actually took 5 years to go. Now I find I can take no more than 25mg (only P5P) per day but then only for a few days per week, using my dreams as a guide. For me it’s not so much recall but that my dreams go from being ‘normal’ stuff like discharging that day’s events usually in some code form, but after too much B6 accumulates my dreams turn absolutely crazy, weird, frightening, breathtaking, heart racing and bring on anxiety. Stuff that never used to happen prior to using B6.
But then I stop for a few days and it settles again. Whilst the later stuff is not toxicity and I have experimented to see if something else is doing it, but keep coming back to the B6, I certainly have seen many people turn psychotic or have nerve damage stuff with prolonged use of B6. Yes it is suppose to be water soluble and so therefore shouldn’t be an issue, but for those with methylation issues toxicity can be real for them. This can happen with both types of B6 but mostly
with the non active pyridoxine hydrochloride. I can’t take that one at all that thank God that P5P was made available finally.
You asked about zinc, yes I have been able to take zinc picolinate at a dose of 100mg elemental per day but had to build that up slowly as initially could only take about 25mg of that too. I always start my sups one at a time so that I know what is doing what to my body, then work with two together in combo and build from there. currently my regime includes multiple minerals incl. managese, lots of magnesium, molybdenum, selenium, chromium, zinc, boron, biotin. My B’s are all active forms (can’t seem to tolerate the others) in a combo called High strength Bio Essentials by Metagenics, which is a multi active B formula that is not over 25mg which suits me well as mentioned above, but get my zinc from iherb and other minerals compounded.
As far as history and toxicity goes, well I had loads of antibiotics as a kid (and pretty crap diet until I left home) but have done much healing and detoxing over the years. Diet is gluten, grain, dairy, sugar, alcohol, caffeine free, low carb, paleo, low oxalate (most of the time, or I too get pain in feet and knees funny enough, but had Ross River and used to blame it on that till I read your post on oxalate). Most days I feel great, but just have to monitor the B6 or my sleep will be rubbish and that tires me dreadfully, and be active everyday (Gym or walk).
I have devises to help with EMF’s etc but it’s everywhere so hard to completely avoid plus eat mostly organic so overall all is well in my world, but the B6 stuff is really annoying as I know my body needs it but just have to keep a monitor on it all the time. The above regime seems to work well for me. Oh and I don’t have any auto-immune conditions but my daughter and mother have/had thyroid issues so there’s weakness there that I’m sure is kept at bay with how I look after myself now. I hope that by sharing this info, that it can help others with similar situations but also know that we are all different in many ways even if energetically we are all actually joined at the hip so to speak. 🙂
All the best, Love sue x
Sue
Gosh it seems I missed a bunch of comments and yours was one of them – my apologies! I get an email for every comment I receive and something must have been broken in August!
Thank you for sharing your story and your experiences with patients. Your situation sounds pretty unique. I’d love to hearwhat made you first connect your symptoms to B6 issues ? Was it a plasma B6 test and what was the range and your levels?
It’s so helpful to hear from another practitioner who is seeing this! Everyone I’ve reached out to says they have never seen this and say it’s highly unlikely given that B6 is water soluble. Other than MTHFR polymorphisms are you seeing any other patterns like more of an issue with patients with infections such as Lyme or in your case Ross River? Or more when there are oxalate issues? (I’m still trying to find a solution for this one!)
And how commonly do you find it to be an issue? And men, women and children? And are you always testing plasma B6? And do adverse symptoms correlate with high plasma B6 and the B6 markers on OAT)? “Elevated levels of xanthurenate in the urine can indicate an insufficiency of vitamin B6, as can elevated levels of kynurenate, especially when xanthurenate is high”
Based on your feedback I’m now also starting to wonder if the manufacturing process of vitamin B6 has changed in recent years and this could be contributing to this possible upswing we’re seeing and why so few practitioners are aware of it?
But then again, with what we know about about EMFs , glyphosate, environmental toxins and medication side-effects, perhaps this reported increase in B6 issues also correlates in some way with these factors too? None of this was around when Carl Pfeiffer was using high levels of B6 with his patients in the 1970s.
And please feel free to share this and any of my articles on your Facebook group! Thanks too for the kind words
Hi Trudy
Here is the video I mentioned already that can help people know if they have the combination of gene snps that my research has found can lead to B6 Toxicity and numerous other inflammatory diseases, including, Autism, MS, Psoriasis and more. https://www.facebook.com/epigenetics.epiphany/videos/1986575414965806/ please visit my page https://www.facebook.com/epigenetics.epiphany/ for more information and posts.
Hi! A couple years ago i read Dr Walsh protocol. Ido t remember to well but he was written about why some autistic children cant tolerate vitamin B6.
Today I will check the book.
Stella
I’d love to hear what you find – thanks
I took 40ish mg of B6 for 1 year, prescribed by a naturopath. I developed severe nerve damage, mostly in my feet and legs. It has been 15 months and my nerves haven’t healed completely although they are better than they were last year. I can’t eat foods containing natural B6 without symptoms, which my doctors think is “all in my head”. I don’t trust doctors anymore. B6 toxicity has ruined my livelihood. I hope my nerves will heal as time goes on.
I took about that same amount for about 4 months before I started noticing the beginning of symptoms in one foot. It took another couple of months as the symptoms increased to figure out what it was, then get a diagnosis. Trudy’s article was the first clue I had that the cause could be B6 toxicity. I have had occasional back problems for several years and scoliosis since I was 5, but I really don’t think at 71 they suddenly caused peripheral neuropathy when they hadn’t over all these years. I hope we both get better with the B6 out of our systems.
Kathryn
Did you get B6 testing done and what was was the name of the test (plasma vitamin B6, RBC pyridoxal-5-phosphate and/or the enzyme pyridoxal kinase?) , lab range and your results?
Sasha – sorry to hear about this. Glad you’re doing better! I’m gathering info to try and find patterns and would love some answers to some of the questions in the blog if you’re willing?
Also did you get testing done and what was was the name of the test, lab range and your results?
The lab test was just called “Vitamin B6”. My lab value was nearly three times the upper limit.
1. Symptoms: sharp stabbing pain in soles of feet, vibrating tibial nerves, shiny and wrinkled skin on palms and soles of feet, ataxia or loss of proprioception. Worse nerve pain when retaining water. Nerve hypersensitivity.
2. Symptoms not 100% resolved, but better. Starting low dose naltrexone has given me huge improvements. Avoiding foods high in B6 has helped tremendously. Avoiding histamine.
3. No.
4. Pyridoxine (synthetic).
5. ~40 mg for one year.
6. N/A
7. Past use of benzodiazepines, gabapentin, SSRIs. No use of fluoroquinolones, PPIs or statins.
8. Moderately high EMF exposure.
9. I eat organic, and avoid plastics and chemicals for the most part.
10. N/A
11. Yes.
12. Yes. Always taken a lot of magnesium.
13. No reaction to oxalates. Reaction to histamine, which creates nerve symptoms similar to ingesting B6 foods.
14. No.
15. No.
Hello! I just came across your blog. Have been experiencing gastrointestinal issues for 6 months along with fatigue, headaches, weight loss, nausea but I dont have any nerve issues. Of all the tests at the doctors the only thing that was off the charts was B6 was very high. I was never diagnosed bc doctors couldn’t figure it out but now I’m wondering if it could be b6 toxicity. I was taking two supplements that had b6.
Christine
Thanks for sharing and sorry to hear this. Sorry to hear you’re going thru this
I don’t have answers right now (especially since you have no neuropathy) but I shared this in my response to Amanda and am sharing here in the hope it sheds more light on the issue.
We know that symptoms of too much vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency and some practitioners are proposing that it’s really vitamin B6 deficiency that is the cause of peripheral neuropathy (and other symptoms) that many individuals are reporting. I’ve come across some autism/vitamin B6 studies that allude to this and discuss some additional tests
They report that the “finding of high vitamin B(6) levels is consistent with recent reports of low levels of pyridoxal-5-phosphate and low activity of pyridoxal kinase (i.e., pyridoxal is only poorly converted to pyridoxal-5-phosphate, the enzymatically active form). This may explain the functional need for high-dose vitamin B(6) supplementation in many children and adults with autism.” This is in study from 2004 – Pilot study of a moderate dose multivitamin/mineral supplement for children with autistic spectrum disorder https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15673999. And is expanded upon in some of their later studies too.
I believe the markers are plasma vitamin B6, RBC pyridoxal-5-phosphate and the enzyme pyridoxal kinase.
Can you share if it was any of these B6 markers that were tested, the lab range and your level?
And what form of B6 and how much you were taking? Did you stop and retest? And see a change in symptoms?
My neurologist who has been practicing for 40 years is baffled with my case. I had B6 toxicity levels THREE times higher than normal with my liver enzymes slightly elevated. Kidneys have cysts on them but function is normal. I developed neuropathy that started on the tops of my feet and worked its way up. I was recently diagnosed with fibromyalgia and I have extreme tension headaches. At first he told me to stop all supplements immediately… the issue… I don’t take any supplements to stop. After a month he tested my B6 levels and they are still twice the toxicity level but he is concerned the level dropped that much in such a short period of time. He is concerned if my levels stay this high which they have now for 10 months that my ability to even stand is in jeopardy if it continues. Anyone else have high levels of B6 but don’t take supplements? Also if I shouldn’t eat foods high in B6 what foods should I be eating since majority contain B vitamins.
You may try to read every label too on packaged food to see who is piling the man made vitamins in the ready made things you are eating. When you start looking you find so much food has been enriched with vitamins. If you cut back on food naturally high in B’s that could bring it down too. I wondered if a topical sources could get absorbed too.
Some body and face lotions put B vitamins in them.
I also wonder if some yogurt bacterias can generate some B vitamins?
God bless you and hope you get well soon.
Jodi
Sorry to hear about this – I don’t have answers right now (especially since you are not taking vitamin B supplements) but I shared this in my response to Amanda and am sharing here in the hope it sheds more light on the issue.
We know that symptoms of too much vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency and some practitioners are proposing that it’s really vitamin B6 deficiency that is the cause of peripheral neuropathy (and other symptoms) that many individuals are reporting. I’ve come across some autism/vitamin B6 studies that allude to this and discuss some additional tests
They report that the “finding of high vitamin B(6) levels is consistent with recent reports of low levels of pyridoxal-5-phosphate and low activity of pyridoxal kinase (i.e., pyridoxal is only poorly converted to pyridoxal-5-phosphate, the enzymatically active form). This may explain the functional need for high-dose vitamin B(6) supplementation in many children and adults with autism.” This is in study from 2004 – Pilot study of a moderate dose multivitamin/mineral supplement for children with autistic spectrum disorder https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15673999. And is expanded upon in some of their later studies too.
I believe the markers are plasma vitamin B6, RBC pyridoxal-5-phosphate and the enzyme pyridoxal kinase.
Can you share if it was any of these B6 markers that were tested, the lab ranges and your levels both times you were tested?
I’m curious if B12, MMA and homocysteine was tested and the results?
Any feedback on other questions in the blog – medications, EMF exposure and GMOs?
” Anyone else have high levels of B6 but don’t take supplements? ” Me! And I want to know why too! Maybe we could get in touch on some forum?
Michal
Do you have any peripheral neuropathy or other symptoms? And what B6 test was done and what is the level?
Trudy, I don’t see an option to answer your post (“Do you have any peripheral neuropathy or other symptoms? And what B6 test was done and what is the level?”), so I’ll reply to my own – hope you’ll see that. There are a few pieces of the puzzle.
1. In Nov 2017 my level of pyridoxine was 49 [ref 8-27] – without any supplementation. I had NO issues with peripheral neuropathy (I checked it for another serious health issues – reportedly all being psychosomatic).
2. Recently – since a few months – I’ve been taking P5P 25-100 mg / day.
Reason: by accident I discovered it helped my restlessness (caused by protracted withdrawal from AD drugs). Again: no issues, only positive things.
3. Recently I took 150 mg/day for 3 days (yes, three!). On the 2nd day tingling in my left hand started. It’s about 5th day without B6 and tingling didn’t go away yet (though had one day of improvement).
Any diagnosis?
Check all energy and sport drinks. I think that’s how my level got elevated as I never took supplements but drank several bottles of propel every day for years.
Hi Trudi,
I’m following this post with interest. I am a nurse who works in a Holistic Health Clinic. I recently had a client (late 30’s) present with a recent diagnosis of MS. She put herself on a multivitamin prior to coming to clinic, but when her vitamin B6 was tested it was over 800… needless to say, she has come off the Vit B6 – we haven’t had it tested again since. I was very curious if the high levels of B6 in her system contributed to the MS diagnosis and if they had the diagnosis wrong and it is indeed a Vit B6 toxicity instead that she is suffering from. Some of her symptoms reduced once she stopped the B6 and made some changes to her diet.
Clearly there seems to be something which is reducing the ability of the body to excrete Vit B6 – but what, how and what do we do about it?
Would love to know if you gain any more knowledge about the subject.
Helen
Thanks for sharing this case – very interesting and I’d love to hear how she’s doing now and if they have removed the MS diagnosis? I’d love to hear what dietary changes she made too and what form of B6 and dose? (probably pyridoxine 25mg in a multi?)
I honestly don’t know if it’s an excretion issue or a testing issue or combination of both (and other factors too – like EMFs, meds, GMOs etc – any ideas on these for your patient and if she made changes in these areas?)
I shared this in my response to Amanda and am sharing here in the hope it sheds more light on the issue.
We know that symptoms of too much vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency and some practitioners are proposing that it’s really vitamin B6 deficiency that is the cause of peripheral neuropathy (and other symptoms) that many individuals are reporting. I’ve come across some autism/vitamin B6 studies that allude to this and discuss some additional tests
They report that the “finding of high vitamin B(6) levels is consistent with recent reports of low levels of pyridoxal-5-phosphate and low activity of pyridoxal kinase (i.e., pyridoxal is only poorly converted to pyridoxal-5-phosphate, the enzymatically active form). This may explain the functional need for high-dose vitamin B(6) supplementation in many children and adults with autism.” This is in study from 2004 – Pilot study of a moderate dose multivitamin/mineral supplement for children with autistic spectrum disorder https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15673999. And is expanded upon in some of their later studies too.
I believe the markers are plasma vitamin B6, RBC pyridoxal-5-phosphate and the enzyme pyridoxal kinase.
Can you share if it was any of these B6 markers that were tested, and the lab range on the test. You mention it was 800. I’d love to hear if it has been retested and the result?
Helen, many people on the B6 toxicity Facebook group mentioned being misdiagnosed with MS.
I was really lucky to FINALLY find a neurologist who is an MS/ALS specialist as the symptoms I was having can get a diagnosis of either (never Google a symptom :-)).. My B6 level was 450 when I was tested a few weeks ago. I plan to go in for another test in the next week or so. I am not sure why my body seems to ‘hold on’ to B6 as I was not taking a ton of it…but had just switched to a new B-Complex and was taking a LOT of magnesium (as was suggested by several doctors for muscle cramping and twitches). I’ve been off the b6 for about 2.5 weeks and symptoms are already much much better (I’ve heard it can take up to 3 weeks to notice a difference and can take up to 4 years for symptoms to fully resolve (sometimes they don’t). I’m taking Alpha Lipoic Acid which is supposed to help nerves recover more quickly.
I am a 55 year old woman. I have been diagnosed with vitamin B6 toxicity. Normal levels should be 25 to 120 , mine was 330. Sever left leg pain. 1 surgery. No one could tell me what was going on until a couple of months ago. Been suffering for years.
Twila
I’m sorry to hear this. I don’t have answers right now but I shared this in my response to Amanda and am sharing here in the hope it sheds more light on the issue.
We know that symptoms of too much vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency and some practitioners are proposing that it’s really vitamin B6 deficiency that is the cause of peripheral neuropathy (and other symptoms) that many individuals are reporting. I’ve come across some autism/vitamin B6 studies that allude to this and discuss some additional tests
They report that the “finding of high vitamin B(6) levels is consistent with recent reports of low levels of pyridoxal-5-phosphate and low activity of pyridoxal kinase (i.e., pyridoxal is only poorly converted to pyridoxal-5-phosphate, the enzymatically active form). This may explain the functional need for high-dose vitamin B(6) supplementation in many children and adults with autism.” This is in study from 2004 – Pilot study of a moderate dose multivitamin/mineral supplement for children with autistic spectrum disorder https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15673999. And is expanded upon in some of their later studies too.
I believe the markers are plasma vitamin B6, RBC pyridoxal-5-phosphate and the enzyme pyridoxal kinase.
Can you share if it was any of these B6 markers that were tested? (you say the rnage was 25 to 120 and yours was 330)
Did none of the questions in the blog apply – in terms of medications (current and past), EMF exposure, GMOs etc?
Trudy, thank you for taking your time to research this very underdiagnosed issue with B 6 toxicity.
I started feeling burning, tingling and numbness in my feet in May 2018. I went to 3 primary care physicians, 3 neurologists, 2 podiatrists, 1 sports medicine doctor and 1 rheumatologist. I was tested for everything….Lupus, rheumatoid arthritis, MS (through a brain MRI), Lyme Disease, B12, Vitamin E, copper, etc. All of the doctors said nothing was wrong. My symptoms got worse and I felt like the sun was really exacerbating everything. I could not take it anymore so I switched primary care physicians and went to my 4th one at the end of August. Based on research I had done, I asked her to test me for B6. The other doctors said they do not test for it because the issues they see are only with B12. My B6 level was at a 70. The PCP who prescribed the test said it was most likely a false lab value. I switched to a functional medicine doctor who has heard of B6 toxicity. I was not on any B vitamin supplements. I was on a multi-vitamin and iron (for iron deficient anemia). They doctor said the levels most likely got so high because I was taking a synthetic form of B6 in the vitamin. I stopped taking the multi-vitamin and iron at the end of August and have had 2 B6 tests since the 1st one. As of yesterday, I am finally at the high end of normal (21). I had a normal EMG/ nerve conduction study in April and another one in August that said they could not get a reading on my sural nerve so the neurologist thinks I have small fiber neuropathy. The doctors still refuse to say this is from B6 toxicity so I still feel like I need to keep searching. Prior to this, I was completely healthy! I exercised everyday and ate relatively well. It has only been a day that my levels are back to normal. Is it possible for nerve damage to continue to progress if B6 was the issue and I stopped taking it? It feels like the symptoms continue to get worse, but I am thinking I should not be too worried since I just got to a normal level yesterday? What are people doing to help their nerves heal?
Trudy, here are answers to your questions:
1. Symptoms are tingling, burning, numbness, sweating, etc. Smptoms exacerbate in the sun. I have been on the same multi-vitamin for several years, but just started to feel symptoms of burning, tingling and numbness in May. Prior to that I would feel a little numbness here and there in my calf over the winter of 2018. I was wondering if this build up of B6 had to do with the iron supplements I had just started in August 2017.
2. Symptoms are not resolving.
3. I started iron supplements in August 2017. I also took magnesium March – May 2018. I was wondering if either of them caused my to build B6 to toxic levels. I was also taking xanax maybe 3 x a week for a couple months to help me sleep (had a cervical herniated disc). I also has a cervical epidural in May so was wondering if that is part of the issue also.
4. and 5. I was taking B6 in the form of a multi-vitamin (only 2mg in it) on a daily basis
6. I was not taking zinc. Only magnesium and iron
Jen
Sorry to hear you’re going thru this
I don’t have answers right now (not even for this question “Is it possible for nerve damage to continue to progress if B6 was the issue and I stopped taking it”) but I shared this in my response to Amanda and am sharing here in the hope it sheds more light on the issue.
We know that symptoms of too much vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency and some practitioners are proposing that it’s really vitamin B6 deficiency that is the cause of peripheral neuropathy (and other symptoms) that many individuals are reporting. I’ve come across some autism/vitamin B6 studies that allude to this and discuss some additional tests
They report that the “finding of high vitamin B(6) levels is consistent with recent reports of low levels of pyridoxal-5-phosphate and low activity of pyridoxal kinase (i.e., pyridoxal is only poorly converted to pyridoxal-5-phosphate, the enzymatically active form). This may explain the functional need for high-dose vitamin B(6) supplementation in many children and adults with autism.” This is in study from 2004 – Pilot study of a moderate dose multivitamin/mineral supplement for children with autistic spectrum disorder https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15673999. And is expanded upon in some of their later studies too.
I believe the markers are plasma vitamin B6, RBC pyridoxal-5-phosphate and the enzyme pyridoxal kinase.
Can you share if it was any of these B6 markers that were tested, the lab ranges and your levels the 3 times you were tested?
Thanks for answering the other questions in the blog. What about EMF exposure and GMOs?
Hi Trudy
Thank you for taking the time to try and figure out the correlation between B6 toxicity and other foods and medications. A year and a half ago I started experiencing terrible burning in my stomach along with dysesthesia (extreme sensitivity to fabric and items that would normally not be felt). In addition I had nausea, light sensitivity and painful twitching. After a year of tests, doctors and emergency room visits I finally went to an acupuncturist who suggested I have my B levels tested. They were three times the recommended level. I had been taking the CVS brand of a B Complex that had 500 times the RDA of B6 . As a side note I do have Hashimoto’s but it had been under control for 20 years.
A year ago I stopped supplementing but continue to have symptoms. I cannot tolerate any B6 foods without terrible flares. That includes chicken, turkey, bananas, beans, avocado, salmon…all the things I practically lived on prior to toxicity.
I started taking gabapentin for the pain in January 2018 and I’m down to 2 a day. My thyroid has been up and down all year. We can not get it to a normal level. I recently have developed histamine like flares where my eyes, nose and throat burn after eating or drinking certain things but I haven’t figured out what.
The only thing I have concluded for myself is that I need to get all of my vitamins through food. B6 is in everything. If you are eating a normal diet you are getting enough B6. This supplement has caused me so much mental and physical pain I would not recommend it to anyone.
Thanks for listening
Bonnie
I don’t have answers right now but I shared this in my response to Amanda and am sharing here in the hope it sheds more light on the issue.
We know that symptoms of too much vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency and some practitioners are proposing that it’s really vitamin B6 deficiency that is the cause of peripheral neuropathy (and other symptoms) that many individuals are reporting. I’ve come across some autism/vitamin B6 studies that allude to this and discuss some additional tests
They report that the “finding of high vitamin B(6) levels is consistent with recent reports of low levels of pyridoxal-5-phosphate and low activity of pyridoxal kinase (i.e., pyridoxal is only poorly converted to pyridoxal-5-phosphate, the enzymatically active form). This may explain the functional need for high-dose vitamin B(6) supplementation in many children and adults with autism.” This is in study from 2004 – Pilot study of a moderate dose multivitamin/mineral supplement for children with autistic spectrum disorder https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15673999. And is expanded upon in some of their later studies too.
I believe the markers are plasma vitamin B6, RBC pyridoxal-5-phosphate and the enzyme pyridoxal kinase.
Can you share if it was any of these B6 markers that were tested, the lab range and your level and the lab range on the test? You say “They were three times the recommended level. ”
Also what foods do you have problems with and what problems? And what foods can you eat?
Did none of the questions in the blog apply – in terms of medications (current and past), EMF exposure, GMOs etc?
Hope you are seeing progress. I wonder if sweating would help you? I wonder if drinking distilled water and getting some sweaty excersise would help? Maybe some fasting. I would think a toxicologist or even a pharmacist would be able to think of things that can help.
My husband’s genetic glitch doesn’t let him get rid of iron very efficiently but sweating is helpful for someone like him and giving blood. Giving blood brought his iron down very quickly. Plus he avoids iron and vitamin C and he makes sure he sweats. Maybe you can look up B6 deficiencies, the reasons for it, then use the information to create a deficiency. Pubmed maybe a good place to look. Lots of published research on everything medical. Also, try to avoid toxins from other sources. Like, chocolate (cadmium and lead), tea should not brew long (aluminum and other metals), coffee should be much weaker too (nickel and other issues). Also make sure your stainless steel pots aren’t leaching nickel into your foods. There is something called food grade stainless steel and you should make sure yours is, not all stainless steel is. I like cooking with glass when possible but great care must be taken with temperature changes of surfaces, and moisture. Glass cookware can explode if you’re not careful. I never use aluminum or stick proof pots to cook with. But all your detox systems will function better if you baby your liver and kidneys. And, if you don’t pray, it would be
good to begin. God hears.
Hope something I mention helps you.
Blessings,
Jo
Hi Jo,
I never supplement with copper, only get it from food. I take grass fed liver capsules which have the correct ratio of copper to iron so iron can be made usable and not stored. Its important to get your minerals/electrolytes tested: potassium, magnesium, sodium, calcium, chloride to see if there is an imbalance. I do all my own blood work, no doc needed at https://www.ultalabtests.com/ Some states do not allow this – I think NY and NJ?
I believe that people who donate blood live longer and are healthier. A ferritin level of 350 is dangerously over the top. Docs do not agree with what ferritin should be. It ranges from 20-120. Personally, I do not want mine to be over 20. That can be something you can research? We need to understand that ferritin is only an indication of whats being stored in the tissues and organs as we cannot measure this! So, on the lower side is better than on the high side. My son had a range of 100 and he was advised to get a H test and his saturation was 40% so he donates blood every 2 months to keep it stable. I test his minerals frequently too because donating blood changes this. (he is 18 years) And he is helping others too! A double bonus.
Take care!
Mandi
Hi Mandi,
Thanks so much for all the info. The link for getting your own labs done looks like something everyone should have. Yes, I agree that my husband’s ferritin is still much too high. Poor guy will go in to donate blood but has been turned down because of borderline anemia. We need to find for certain what sort of copper problems he may have. We have no idea about saturation nor it’s signifance in this case. Doctors just seem to blow all of this off. But if a person has inflammation and anemia and high ferritin, then wouldn’t you think a doctor specializing in blood would tackle that with some great suggestions? Well, nope, that is not how it went down. Because my husband had symptoms but only one bad gene the doctor thought all should be well. But the standard is so poor for bringing health to a person that just limping along should be something you just tolerate. But if a few simple tweeks bring vibrant health, why would a doctor not reach for that knowledge and the solution? The doctor said to my husband, “Usually we see people much sicker by the time they reach your age when they have your problem.”That sounds like he was saying people are just falling apart by the time a doctor accidentally discovers the problem. Pathetic. And, to think of the diabetes epidemic out there. Many of those people have the one bad gene just like my husband has. He is only still healthy because of his heroic efforts to eat healthy and exercise like a madman throughout the years. He didn’t know what was lurking genetically at that time. But the good news is that a cup of green tea with a meal can also help reduce iron absorption. And the article you referenced showed a possibility of IP6 helping to get rid of some. Chelation would help but he isn’t ready for that. I did see a doctor’s research about longevity and health because of blood donation. It was fascinating, it even helps become more insulin sensitive, helping diabetics. I may start giving blood soon also.
Thanks again Mandi.
Jo
Hi Jo,
I think that your husband would really benefit from the root cause protocol: http://gotmag.org/the-root-cause-protocol/
So he has anemia and iron overload so I presume his hemoglobin is below 13.5 so he cant donate blood? Take a look at the link as I really think this protocol will be very helpful. There are ways to increase Hem and ceruloplasmin, balance minerals and chelate iron.
Thanks for listening,
Mandi
Thank you so much Jo these are great ideas !!!!
my son was told he has a very high level of B6 . he is not taking supplements. what can cause this? he also has development tingling in his pinky and ring finger, any feedback is appreciated
Diana
I don’t have answers right now but I shared this in my response to Amanda and am sharing here in the hope it sheds more light on the issue.
We know that symptoms of too much vitamin B6 supplementation are similar to those of vitamin B6 deficiency and some practitioners are proposing that it’s really vitamin B6 deficiency that is the cause of peripheral neuropathy (and other symptoms) that many individuals are reporting. I’ve come across some autism/vitamin B6 studies that allude to this and discuss some additional tests
They report that the “finding of high vitamin B(6) levels is consistent with recent reports of low levels of pyridoxal-5-phosphate and low activity of pyridoxal kinase (i.e., pyridoxal is only poorly converted to pyridoxal-5-phosphate, the enzymatically active form). This may explain the functional need for high-dose vitamin B(6) supplementation in many children and adults with autism.” This is in study from 2004 – Pilot study of a moderate dose multivitamin/mineral supplement for children with autistic spectrum disorder https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15673999. And is expanded upon in some of their later studies too.
I believe the markers are plasma vitamin B6, RBC pyridoxal-5-phosphate and the enzyme pyridoxal kinase.
Can you share if it was any of these B6 markers that were tested, the lab range and your son’s level?
I’ve been grain-free for over 6-1/2 years, and almost immediately my severe environmental allergies, depression, GERD, and IBS vanished. That was nothing short of a miracle for me. A little less than a year later, I started having neuropathy and eventually discovered B6 toxicity after taking about 25 mg for 1-2 years. My levels were slightly elevated and I stopped all B6, but the symptoms remain, long after my levels returned to normal shortly after I stopped all B6.
About a month before my symptoms started, I had an extremely stressful event happen in my life, I know major stress in my lifetime has triggered a lot of this, probably turning on some genetic mutations and making them active. The question is which mutations and how to turn them off? So complex.
About 4 years ago, I started AIP for gut healing and to hopefully help my neuropathy symptoms. It didn’t make a difference but I do feel my gut has healed in that time. I stayed on the AIP diet for about 18 months, no dairy, soy, nuts, grains, processed food, nuts, legumes, caffeine, etc.
I do notice my symptoms of burning is worse when I eat foods high in B6, which is in just about every “healthy” food, ie banana, avocado, greens, etc.
My symptoms are there 24/7 but wax and wane in intensity with no obvious triggers other than food. Weather change, hormonal changes, stress, etc., don’t cause the symptoms to worsen.
I have burning in my feet, legs, arms, hands, face, scalp, ears, eyelids, and lips. When things are at their worst, I have numbness in my feet and legs in different spots.
I can’t take P-5-P or pyridoxine. Both cause unbearable burning and numbness throughout my body.
I’ve never taken benzos, gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP, SSRIs, fluroquinolone abx, PPIs, not diabetic, no statins, or BP meds.
I drink water from our Berkey and have for several years. I eat a very clean diet.
I was working from home when the symptoms began almost 6 years ago. We have WiFi, no smart meter where we lived up until 2 years ago. Now we live in a condo where the meters are located all in one place and about 3 units down from us. I have a cell phone but don’t use it that much.
I have always had extremely busy and vivid dreams every night. It’s like I live a 2nd life in my sleep, and it can be exhausting. I say that because low B6 has been linked to not being able to recall dreams well, from what I’ve read.
My Spectracell test last year was normal. My Pyridoxal 5-Phosphate blood test was 46 in a range of 20-125 earlier this month. B12, MMA, homocysteine have been consistently normal.
I’ve been worked up by all kinds of medical doctors, several homeopaths, naturopaths, etc. And have had blood tests, MRIs, nerve conduction studies, skin biopsy for small fiber neuropathy,
I was diagnosed hypothyroid about 3 years ago and am doing very well on Natural Dessicated Thyroid medication, Nature-Throid, and Cytomel. No Hashis. I also have hemochromatosis.
I take magnesium (have tried many different forms) and zinc, along with selenium, Vitamin D and K, probiotics, digestive enzymes.
I’ve been working with Dr Jay Davidson’s associate for 9 months doing cleansing and detoxing of heavy metals and parasites. I had all 4 amagams removed earlier in the year by a biologic dentist. I get into an infrared sauna 3 days a week and do coffee enemas 3 days a week. I’ve been working on making sure my drainage pathways are open in the lymph, kidneys, liver, digestive system and working on that for close to a year. I’m able to ride my recumbent exercise bike 6 days a week for 30 minutes and sweat heavily doing that.
I’m sorry this is so long. I’m reading through the comments above and trying to answer as many questions as I can that I’ve seen you bring up.
I don’t know if the damage is permanent at this point. It’s very discouraging.
Kay,
Are you donating blood to help your hemochromatosis? Iron overload causes oxidative stress which affects tissues and organs and will affect detox and iron also feeds parasites. What are your ferritin and iron levels? From everything you wrote, this was the red flag for me.
Mandi,
I was diagnosed with hereditary hemochromatosis 2-1/2 years ago. The doctor said I am the 1st patient he’s ever diagnosed before liver damage had taken place. I caught it VERY early after being anemic and put on oral iron (very heavy periods all my life). Then my periods got very irregular as I’m nearing menopause, and the iron pills shot my iron saturation up to 89%. My ferritin went from 14 to 106. So I stopped the iron, but my levels continued to rise, so I insisted on the test for HH, and my suspicion was correct. I’ve only had to give blood once so far. My ferritin is currently 46, iron 140, and saturation 56%. My neuropathy symptoms started 3 years before my iron went up. Thank you so much for your input. I welcome it all as you never know what might be the missing key to unlock this mystery.
Hi Kay,
Iron has two ‘faces.” Functional and non-functional. Anemia does not mean that you don`t have enough iron; it means that you have too much non functional (storage) iron and not enough functional (usable) iron. So people with “anemia of chronic inflammation” are not lacking in iron but overloaded with it! So you have too much iron that cannot be used and which causes oxidation stress which increases free radicals. For iron to be made functional, it needs copper and ceruloplasmin which is the protein that carries copper. Many docs, including functional do not know what the ceruloplasmin is nor do they make the connection that iron needs copper to be functional. My guess is that you have iron dysregulation and that`s why you have an iron overload because your iron gets stored instead of being used as you don`t have enough bioavailable copper to convert it. Please read this post – it has studies and lots of very good research and information and how balancing minerals affect all of this. http://gotmag.org/iron-toxicity-post-51-the-deceit-of-anemia/
On another note, iron overload affects the thyroid. When the liver is congested with non-functional iron it slows down the conversion of T4 to T3. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18299688 (hemochromatosis and thyroid issues)
Your iron levels are still very high and donating blood more often will help with that. I believe that if you clear your iron overload, this will help detox pathways in the organs. Remember ferritin is just an indication of what you may have stored in the tissues so when you give blood, the ferritin will go down but when you stop, it will continue to rise because the iron in the tissues are replacing the iron in ferritin. So you will need to keep donating, for life because you have H otherwise it will keep rising. I wonder if you have secondary hemochromatosis from taking iron supplements? (or had a transfusion?)
I hope this info helps you!
Mandi
Hi Mandi,
Interesting about the copper issue and anemia. I had read about that. But people have to be very careful about supplementing with copper. There is only one form of copper that I have heard of that is safer for the brain and that is what you would get in certain foods. Copper in pipes, cookware, and usually in supplements, and all other forms I have read are actually toxic. I don’t know if copper is used in IUDs for birth control anymore, but it was put in the IUD because copper is toxic to sperm. But the safer thing to do is make sure you only get copper from food if you want to take it. I read about some scientists who were inducing Alzheimer’s in mice in a lab in NY and were then experimenting with possible treatments on their disease. Well, they moved eventually to a lovely new lab in Arizona. But, they ran into a snag there. They were unable to get the mice to develop Alzheimer’s like before. Turned out the old lab in NY had old copper pipes and that was the contributing factor. The brand new location had plastic piping, the mice water didn’t contain that form of copper that was helping to make them sick. I know that a mouse is different than a human but, a toxin is a toxin. Copper is necessary in the right form, and small amounts.
Thanks for the links to the research about the iron, etc. I read some of it and loved it. My husband is doing well now controlling his iron levels. He only has the one bad gene so he is not as bad off as someone with two bad genes. But if his ferritin gets up to 350 he begins to have symptoms. Sore joints, wrist pain, back aches. His hands used to burn like fire before we found out what was wrong. Now he is so much better and rarely has pain anywhere. But I think of the people all over America going around with the same problem as my husband but no doctor does testing for ferritin unless you see a blood specialist. Crazy, because a ferritin test only costs $27. I say everyone should get a test for high ferritin. Even if you only carry one bad gene it is causing havoc in your body to have high ferritin.
Thank you for your informative post. I misspoke though. I was told I had “iron deficiency,” not anemia, when my ferritin was 14, iron 74, and saturation 30%. I only took iron supplements for a couple of months, back in 2015, and have never had a blood transfusion. The neuropathy has been the same for almost 6 years, when my iron labs were lower and when they were high because of the hereditary hemochromatosis kicking in. I plan to give blood again at the end of the month and will do so for the rest of my life. The neuropathy is my main issue right now. I’ve been able to get rid of all my other issues except for that, and that’s what has me completely stumped at this point. I do know that foods high in B6 cause the burning and numbness to get severe. It’s a huge mystery for me and every practitioner I’ve consulted with in the last 6 years, which have been many, mainstream and alternative.
Hi Kai, I have the same exact symptoms and just as frustrated by the lack of progress. It’s been 4 years and started with gi issues and then transformed into neuropathy symptoms about a year ago, also after a stressful event. I discovered that my b6 was very high 345, also very high mercury, removed the amalgam, stopped b6 supplement, took various things for h pylori, blactocystis, seen functional docs, etc. but no luck so far. Have you been able to make progress since?
Hi Kay, wondering if your symptoms have resolved and how long it took since you stopped taking the supplement? I too have a B6 toxicity, a range of GI related issues mostly around GI motility. I just posted details below.
Discovered what the problem was when I was in my 40s , So I avoided b six the best I could. Then took it hidden in supplements
Age 73 and can’t seem to rid of it for past two years. 5 cell phone and wi fi. 6 not much zinc # 7. Coprocessor, statins, hormones. # 12 now taking magnesium.
13. Avacado, spinach and chicken or turkey and mushrooms, worse foods for me #14 yes
Hi Trudy,
I have been taking B6 and zinc to treat Pyroluria for a good four years. I first learned about Pyroluria here (thank you for your research, book, postings and quick communication, Trudy! I’m a classical musician who occasionally posts here). Your site continues to be a wonderful source of fantastic information!
I initially took B6 ( up to 200 mg per day) and developed mild tingling in my toes (after about 4 months). I had read that if that if such symptoms occur with high B6, to switch to the P5P form. I did that, taking one or two 50mg P5P tabs per day (Pure Encapsulations) and have had no issues with numbness or tingling in my feet since.
I believe it is the orthomolecular doctors who are aware (and have been aware for decades) that the activated form of B6 – that is P5P – will react better for some people; it is known to not create the neuropathy that plain B6 does. (For example, perhaps Dr. William Walsh or Dr. Woody McGinnis have published data about this? Perhaps there is data at the orthomolecular physicians’ website: http://orthomolecular.org/ ?)
Trudy, there is another factor which needs research and investigation: how is the B6 in vitamins being created / manufactured?
First off: at some point in recent history, the vitamin industry switched from one form of B6 to another (due to pressure from Big Pharma, which forced the FDA’s hand). I don’t know the exact B6 names but, given this fact, has anyone researched to determine if this newer form of B6 is causing problems?
Second: in researching an article I wrote about the toxicity of MSG (correctly called ‘processed free gluatamic acid’), I discovered that MSG is created (in large part in the US) in labs, fermenting genetically modified (GM) bacteria which are, themselves, fed upon a medium of sugar beets: 95% of which are GMO and Round-Up Ready (if grown in the US).
So, with MSG, we have a highly neoro-toxic chemical – to begin with – now being produced with GM bacteria (!!!), grown upon a Round-Up – poisoned, GM sugar beet medium!!!
It is well-known among home fermenters that the process of fermentation boosts the availability of nutrients therein.
So, is the food industry boosting the inherent toxicity of MSG by HOW it is being manufactured: genetic modification of the bacteria themselves, and genetic modification of the very food they eat, that food made toxic with glyphosate/Round-Up?
Would you knowingly eat a food product with THAT slurry in it?
What does that do to one’s gut bacteria? The gut-brain connection?
Nobody knows the toxic effect of these MSG manufacturing processes upon a human body! Because nobody is looking at it…
So, the question I wish someone could answer is: how is B6 being produced in labs? Are they now using GM bacteria, as with MSG production? Are those bacteria being fed GM, Round-Up Ready food? If so, what devilish things would this combination do to a human body? Do we even know? Is anybody asking?
I know from my research into MSG/processed free glutamic acid, that products like nutritional yeast (known for its high B vitamin content) are highly chemically-processed, made in a lab, and full of processed free glutamic acid; some nutritional yeast flakes’ brands get most of their B vitamin content from B vitamins added in, AFTER the yeast has been fermented!
I stopped using nutritional yeast flakes as a source of B vitamins in my diet after researching exacting HOW it is manufactured and that it contains hidden MSG.
I might do the same thing to B vitamins, if somebody finds out that B vitamin production has gone the same way as MSG production.
Given the triple whammy toxicity of manufactured MSG (which, BTW, is no longer called MSG on food labels, there are about 50 different ingredient names now utilized, which effectively HIDE the fact that there is processed free gluatamic acid (hidden MSG) in that food product, some estimate 80-90% of processed food today has hidden MSG in it), it would be interesting if someone with the know-how could research this issue and let us know if the product itself, B6 – and the means used to create it – are causing trouble in a human body.
Finally: there is the wild card of the source of the B6. Is it being produced in China, for example, and being granted “organic” or “all natural” or “GMO-Free” status by one or another nefarious “certifying agents” at the US border (e.g., “QAI”)? Organic: when, in fact, it is likely full of invisible heavy metals, which that very “organic,” or “GMO-Free” label keeps effectively hidden from the consumer?
What’s REALLY in that B6 produced in China and what effect has that chemical mixture upon a human body, especially if taken every single day in a vitamin pill?
Finally: when did the US start sourcing its B vitamins from China? Does that correlate with people beginning to have issues with B6 or B vitamins?
I believe the form of B6 which was removed from sales as a vitamin in 2009-and reclassified as a drug by the FDA-was Pyridoxamine. (A pharmaceutical co. was successfully using it to treat diabetic neuropathy and successfully petitioned the FDA to grant it the rights to this vitamin. (!) )
Laura
Correct on Pyridoxamine but it appears to have been halted “NephroGenex—licensed commercial rights for Pyridorin and continued clinical development of the drug to examine it as a treatment for diabetic nephropathy in patients with Type 2 diabetes. In 2016, the petition noted, NephroGenex halted a Phase 3 study of Pyridorin due to an absence of funding and filed a Chapter 11 bankruptcy.” https://www.naturalproductsinsider.com/regulatory/fda-petition-implicates-interests-dietary-supplement-pharmaceutical-industries
Laura
Thanks for sharing your B6/P5P experience. Good to hear that P5P works for you. And yes some folks get better symptom resolution with P5P (anxiety, social anxiety, carpel tunnel, PMS etc) . I assume the P5P helps your pyroluria symptoms? Any other benefits?
We must keep in mind that the reported toxicity issues are for both forms – vitamin B6/pyridoxine and P5P.
Thanks for the helpful commentary on the source/manufacturing of vitamin B6 and P5P. All something to consider. I actually just commented on Sue’s August post saying this: “I’m now also starting to wonder if the manufacturing process of vitamin B6 has changed in recent years and this could be contributing to this possible upswing we’re seeing and why so few practitioners are aware of it?”
I’m going to reach out to some of the companies making the practitioner supplements I recommend.
And to your point about GMOs/glyphosate I said this ” with what we know about about EMFs , glyphosate, environmental toxins and medication side-effects, perhaps this reported increase in B6 issues also correlates in some way with these factors too? None of this was around when Carl Pfeiffer was using high levels of B6 with his patients in the 1970s.”
Another ominous thing to consider is that citric acid (added to tons of different products) is made by using corn or beets mixed with a type of black mold to ferment and make the citric acid. Not good. Consider that no human will do well with bits of toxin from black mold. I have been purging my shelves of all the phoney fads of super foods and supplements. Did you know gogi berries actually can carry a parasite that can give you heart disease? Glad I didn’t get into that nightshade plant, fake “super food”.
Jo
Jo, I was aware that Gogi berries are in the nightshade family and could cause some people difficulty; do you have a source which discusses this parasite which they contain and it’s dangers?
I agree re. citric acid. Modern citric acid is NOT sourced from lemons or limes! It is, like MSG, manufactured in a lab using GM (non-organic) corn and, again, fermentation. (I did not know about the black mold; that is very scary.) Since the majority of US corn is both GM and non-organic AND sourced from seeds which are neonicotinoid-coated (neonics are the type of pesticides which have been documented as causing colony collapse disorder in honey bees, worldwide) citric acid is also a toxic addition to our food supply.
It contains processed free glutamic acid (hidden MSG) and it is legally allowed to be used in foods labeled as “organic,” per the USDA National Organic Standards Board.
Eating Muir Glen “organic” tomato sauce one night put me in bed for two days with a massive headache and toxicity (Muir Glen is an “organic” arm of General Mills.) On their list of ingredients, the only unknown or suspect ingredient was “citric acid” (To be dead accurate, it could have also been the “sea salt,” as there are indications that sea salt may now be allowed to have additives which are not disclosed. However, subsequent foods eaten with citric acid proved IT was, in fact, the toxic substance.)
I have learned to avoid ANY ingestion of this poisonous, innocent-sounding chemical additive, called citric acid.
And it is one of those 50+ food additives which has hidden MSG. It is showing up in all kinds of foods, especially those labeled “organic.”
Here is a good article about the pyridoxamine firm of B6 and its removal from supplement sales in the US in 2009:
“https://www.lifeextension.com/Magazine/2009/7/FDA-Seeks-to-Ban-Pyridoxamine/Page-01
The article states:
“Unlike pyridoxine (the standard form of B6), high doses of pyridoxamine can be taken without concern for peripheral neuropathy.”
Hi Laura and All Concerned Readers,
I stand corrected. The berry that can give you the parasite that causes heart disease is the acai berry. The berry can be harvested in areas with the kissing bug, that poops on the berries, there by leaving the parasite behind in it’s feces. If you drink the unpasteurized juice or fruit that parasite can proliferate in you and give you a kind of heart disease called Chagas Disease, and or in an intestinal disease called mega colon. There are many articles about this growing problem. The kissing bug is in Mexico and South America and also in the southern US. Veterinarians even see it in house pets if they have been bitten. Also blood donation centers test for it, as a person given the blood will get the parasite from an infected donor. They call Chagas Disease a neglected disease because doctors are not taught about it. But it is estimated that in the US there are slightly less than 1 million and some people claim much more. Irregular heart beat is one of the symptoms. But not all people get Chagas’ from a bite because not all of the bugs are themselves infected.
But on the other subject of gogi berries, I did some reading. Lots of people posting about getting very sick a few hours after eating them. Some Chinese people post that they don’t eat them raw or in any large quantities like eating other berries. They only throw a few raw ones in a kettle of soup. They don’t eat them the way that is promoted by the health food gurus in the US and elsewhere. All I can say is potent nightshade, not for me.
I skip the acia berries and supplements with them completely. I skip most supplements now. Makes for a better family budget and health.
I was hospitalized three different times after taking B6. The first time was in January 2014. I took a vitamin B complex prescribed by my naturopath. I began shivering profusely and felt weak and out of it. I slept a lot I had pain radiating through my hips and legs. After about two days, I didn’t recognize my husband and daughter. I spent a few days in the hospital and they said I had encephalopathy and sepsis syndrome with no know epidemiology. I told the doctors and nurses and whoever would listen about the vitamin B complex but it was considered coincidental. Then, a month later, I took another vitamin B complex. This time the pain started shooting throughout my body. My blood pressure plummeted. I was in ICU for a week. I was nauseous and weak and had a terrible headache. I couldn’t walk and had incredibly low blood pressure. They said I had sepsis and aseptic meningitis. I again told everyone who would listen about the vitamin B complex but it was discounted. Needless to say, I reported it to the FDA with no response. I assumed it was a bad batch or something. It was a Thorne brand B complex capsule with 200 mg as pyridoxine HCl and 6.8mg as Pyridoxal 5′-phosphate. It was 10,340% DV. Then again, in August of 2018, I ordered a new bottle B6 vitamin with 100 mg vitamin B6 (from Pyridoxine HCl) 5882% daily value. I had been under a fair amount of stress and had heard that it would help. I took one pill and within an hour was screaming in pain, I was convulsing and shaking and thought I would die. I threw up several times in the ER waiting room. Interestingly, n all three cases, my Lactate levels were high. They gave me pain meds through an IV and sent me home. I couldn’t walk for a few days as I continued to feel weak and had pains shooting through my back, buttocks and lower legs when I stood. I threw up and had a severe headache and was super sensitive to light. Thankfully, my husband stayed home and cared for me for several days. After a few weeks, all the pain in my legs went away. I have no further symptoms four months out.
I had no other changes with medications etc. I should note that I have hashimotos disease (low thyroid) and sjogrens and lupus. I take hydroxychloroquine, and levothyroxine. I also take a heavy duty immunosuppressant called Mychopenolate Mofetil now but have only been taking it the last few years.
I only took one capsule with each episode..just one. I don’t have pyroluria. I wasn’t taking zinc. I have no past history with benzodiazepines, birth control, SSRIs or antidepressants. I took lots of antibiotics as a child and I’m allergic or have a terrible reaction to minocycline.
We have a computer that I use fairly regularly and I have a cell phone that’s with me always.
I’m pretty careful with my diet. I try to eat organic, whole foods. I don’t know about roundup exposure but I don’t think so. I’m not sure what polymorisms are. I expect that I carry the MTHFR gene. I’ve not been tested but my sister carries it. I do not take magnesium. My potassium levels were very low in the hospital.
I haven’t noticed any differences with intake of dietary oxalates. I eat plenty of foods with vitamin b in them and don’t notice any symptoms. I even eat fortified cereals.
I appreciate your interest in this. My GP knows what I’ve been through and the correlation to the B vitamin but most doctors won’t even listen. In fact, this last time at the hospital, they coded it in such a way that my insurance won’t cover it. It’s considered a “non-emergency in an emergency facility.” I don’t even know what to do from here besides avoid B vitamin supplements like the plague! I wish I knew why my body reacts this way to vitamins. I’m assuming it has something to do with them being synthetic and at such high doses?
Totally terrible luck with the B6 girl. The more I hear about supplements the more I am convinced to try to find a way to just eat real food. Who knows what the supplement world is throwing in your little expensive bottles. You even have to be careful with the “superfoods” that are suddenly being promoted. Flaxseeds almost did me in.
Some supplements are beneficial, but it is a field of landmines for sure.
Hope you feel better soon.
Stephanie
Thanks for sharing your harrowing journey with taking B complex supplements – wow! How disappointing that the hospital won’t code it so it’s covered by insurance! Thanks too for answering all the other questions. I don’t yet have answers and am not seeing any patterns yet except possibly EMF exposure. Did you have Wifi installed in 2014 or get a smart meter or get a cordless phone then?
Can I assume you had taken a B complex supplement before 2014 and not had a reaction like any of these?
May I ask when you started on hydroxychloroquine, levothyroxine and Mychopenolate Mofetil?
I have taken various forms of b6 and they all seem to give me headaches.
I have compound heterozygous mthfr.
Polyuria issues
Anxiety and depression issues.
Sam
Sorry to hear. We’d love to hear which products and what doses? And if less was not an issue?
I developed tingling in my left arm last summer. It spread to my right hand and then into my legs and would move around. Meaning it would disappear and reappear in the different limbs. Originally I thought maybe I injured my back and went to a chiropractor. No improvement. I worried that maybe I had MS or some similar type of problem. I’m the type of person that reads a lot and probably knows more than the average person about medical topics. I did a full blood panel and most everything looked normal except one of the liver enzymes slightly elevated I checked my B12 and MMA levels, and they both looked ok but one thing made me suspicious. The B12 number seemed higher than it should since I was not supplementing and I was not really eating a diet rich in B12.
About 7 years ago I came down with a mystery illness that felt like a UTI. I went to doctors and urologists and they could not find anything wrong with me. The urologist thought I probably had a stealth prostate infection and told me to take Cipro for 1.5 months. Not knowing what I know now that was a huge mistake. Ever since I took that my life has never been the same and it did nothing to improve my condition . I developed chronic insomnia and really have never been able to get over it and needed to bandaid with things like Cannabis just to fall asleep. I developed anxiety and sensitivity to light at night. Sensitivity to sound and I have a pretty high heart rate. I’ve had my thyroid checked, full panel and TPO and all the numbers are good.
So why mention all of this? Back to the first paragraph. My condition continued to decline and I was having a hard time walking and standing for long periods of time. I was having trouble typing and lingered on and on for months not knowing what was wrong with me. Just before the holiday but after the B12 and blood work I did a DNA test. I plugged my results through various sites and educated myself about what my results meant. I have the compound heterozygous 677T/1298C mutations and homozygous VDR TAQ. Like most people my vitamin D was very low at 22. I checked my homocysteine level (elevated at 11.5) and my B6 (115 ng/mL or 335 nmol/L and also checked Copper at 131 mcg/dL. I decided to go to a functional medicine doctor and did an OATs test and have high oxalates as well as some other interesting markers. Also a TOX test showed very high perchlorate as well as other plastics.
While I did supplement with a multivitamin at somepoint that did not have methylated b6, I was never a heavy supplementer. Looking back on my whole experience I should have noticed neurological signs developing years ago that I wrote off to getting older. Losing flexibility, my legs feeling stiff and having less energy overall. This would ultimately develop into what I mentioned above. At the moment I have slight improvement on methyfolate 400mcg and a combo B12 pill with two forms of B12. The B6 I have not addressed yet as I want to be very careful how I approach it.
Last thing to mention is I had 5 amalgam (Mercury) fillings in my mouth. I had them removed over the last several months. I cannot say for sure its responsible but I’d say its a safe bet its a contributing factor. Why do I say this? I’ve seen so many people tell a story that is almost identical. Person has amalgam fillings, finds out they are positive for one or more MTHFR mutations and develops strange unexplainable health problems 30 years after getting the amalgams.
I write this hoping someone will read this that is unwell and has no idea why. Maybe you do not have a doctor that is willing to think outside the box. I would encourage anyone with strange health problems to get a genetic test and work with a doctor that will think outside the box. Consider all possibilities and its likely you will find something interesting that may help you change your situation.
Jeff
Thanks for sharing your story here and so glad you’re working with a doctor who is thinking outside the box and looking at the many root causes of these types of symptoms: metals, medications, low B12, low folate and even low vitamin B6. With migrating symptoms Lyme disease should always be considered.
Re Cipro check out my interview with Lisa Bloomquist on fluoroquinolone antibiotics https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/antibiotic-anxiety-fluoroquinolone/ She has some excellent resources on her site
Re the anxiety and insomnia I have clients do trials of GABA and tryptophan and always look at low magnesium when esp when fluoroquinolone antibiotics are involved
I hope you continue to improve
I took Metagenics Vitamins without Iron for 2 years and only took 3 a day, instead of 6 a day. I now have B6 toxicity. The amount of B6 in these tablets for 6 a day, the recommended amount to take, had 40 mg in them. I had results from a blood test come back at 119.9 and you should only have between 1.5-27 in your blood. My neurologist said he had never had a patient test that high…..So I have been poisoned by these vitamins! I was told by my Neurologist that people should never take more than 2.5mg a day, better would be 1.5mg. I am 72 and am having hideous problems with nerve damage to my feet. I can’t sleep as they wake me up in the middle of the night! I have horrible episodes of spasms in my right foot that I had toe surgery on last year and can’t move as they are just strong and severe and they just paralyze me. I haven’t driven in 3 months as my husband is afraid if I have one of these episodes while driving I might kill myself or injure someone else. DO NOT TAKE SYNTHETIC B6 VITAMINS as I don’t believe you excrete them. I believe it’s a cumulative effect that remains in your body! It is February 11, 2019 and I have been off of them since December 21, 2018. My doctor tells me it can take up to 6 months to get any results, if ever, which is scary! The FDA needs to be regulated and you don’t need vitamins unless you’ve been tested and you are very low in them! I hope that this never happens to another person as I have a life to live and it’s been put on hold because of this mess I am in….The sad part if my OB/GYN told me to take them! Scary!!!! Eat organic and stay away from vitamins! They may have ruined me for the rest of my life!
Jan-Marie
Thanks for sharing and sorry to hear about your issues. As I’ve mentioned in other replies I don’t know for sure if B6 toxicity is the issue since the testing is not a reliable marker for high B6, because there are many other root causes (including low B6) that can cause neuropathic symptoms; and because so many people see amazing benefits for PMS, carpel tunnel, social anxiety, depression and more (with much research supporting this).
I know my response is of no comfort to you but I will continue to dig into the research so I can get to the bottom of this. If you’d be kind enough to share about some of the questions I posed this will give me more data for looking for patterns (meds, GMOs, EMFs etc)
I can share this helpful feedback – clients who have spasms I look at low magnesium (and other electrolytes) and low GABA too.
This is all so interesting. I am a practitioner with 15 years’ experience (and former colleague of Trudy’s at Julia Ross’ office) and have never once had a client have irreversible neuropathy from B6 at any dose. And only one person had tingling that stopped when the 100 mg B6 was discontinued. I have seen a number of clients with the neuropathy issue that turned out to be B12 deficiency, very common and the most well-known to cause this. Second is undiagnosed Hashimoto’s. Changes in thyroid levels can definitely cause muscle and nerve pain. About 95% of allopathic docs have no idea how to read thyroid tests (or when to order them) either.
Even throwing in SNPs, difficult liver detoxification, and other confounding issues, I am baffled as to how a tiny dose can cause irreversible nerve damage. Does anyone test their methyl malonic acid levels for B12 at the same time as the B6 test? Vitamin B tests tend to unreliable, which is why the methyl malonic acid is the go-to test and not just B12, which is not very good except for finding very low levels. I have never ordered a B6 test and never will. Ditto vitamin E testing, and a deficiency of that can cause neurological pain too. But except for severe B12 deficiency, the neuropathies are reversible. And no doctor worth anything will diagnose based on one abnormal lab result.
Here is an excellent article on interpreting B6 lab tests and why they are interpreted wrong so often. https://www.easy-immune-health.com/vitamin-b6-toxicity.html
I stopped using B6 with clients and went to P-5-P about 8 years ago only because I was finding too many who had no results from the B6 (in terms of dreaming) but did quite well with P-5-P. And it boosted the mood better. I personally take 250-300 mg P-5-P (I have pyroluria).
Here is from a talk I gave on thyroid issues and pain but touches on nutrients in general. It digresses from B6 but shows more common scenarios.
Autoimmune diseases can be a significant contributor to nerve pain. This problem causes your immune cells to attack your body by mistake. These diseases can affect almost any part of the body and can cause pain and swelling. Some autoimmune disorders, such as lupus and rheumatoid arthritis, are not only painful, but they also raise the risk for developing hypothyroidism.
WHAT VITAMIN AND MINERAL DEFICIENCIES ARE RELATED TO PAIN?
There is a strong correlation between certain nutrients needed for proper thyroid function and specific nutrient deficiencies related to pain. Based on innumerable studies the nutrient deficiencies related to pain in general are the vitamins D, E, B12, the minerals magnesium, calcium, zinc, and omega-3s fatty acids.
From that list the following nutrients are needed for optimal thyroid health. Vitamins D, E, B12, and zinc. There are other vitamins and minerals that are needed for proper functioning, but a deficiency in any of these can be part of the hypothyroidism-pain connection.
Vitamin D is one of the major players in both thyroid function and pain modulation. The thyroid gland needs vitamin D to be waiting in the cells in order for the thyroid hormone to affect that cell. Thyroid hormone that’s floating around in our serum or blood stream does us very little good. The hormone has to get inside the cell to be effective. As far as this relates to pain, vitamin D has been studied extensively for muscle and bone pain, chronic general pain, and headaches. In 2003 there was a study of people going to a health clinic in Minnesota. Clinicians discovered 93% of those complaining of chronic pain were also deficient in vitamin D. I want to quote the lead researcher, Dr Plotnikoff, because his words are so telling and there is a good chance that you have heard some of them yourself: “The group with the lowest levels of vitamin D were white women of childbearing age,” he says. “Most of them were dismissed by their doctors as depressed or whiners. They attributed their pain to an inability to manage stress. But after we replenished their vitamin D, these people said, ‘Woo hoo! I’ve got my life back!’” You know this finding would have to be huge for a researcher to say something like that.
There is a significant amount of research about vitamin E as it affects neurological pain. And the thyroid needs Vitamin E along with the mineral selenium because it needs to have both of those nutrients to convert the mostly inactive free, as in unbound, T4 into free T3, which is metabolically most active.
Probably the most well-studied vitamin as it relates to pain is nerve damage from a vitamin B12 deficiency. If this deficiency goes on long enough this pain and damage can become permanent. It’s needed by the thyroid but research still is looking for a reason as to why it is needed. If you don’t eat red meat such as beef and lamb and certain fish and do not take vitamin B12 supplements you might be at high risk for nerve damage.
Karla
Thanks for reading and contributing to the discussion. I’m in the process of reaching out to colleagues and like you and I, no-one is seeing this to be an issue related to high levels of vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P.
I agree that B12 and MMA, together with homocysteine is the best indication of B12 status and that neurological damage including peripheral neuropathy is a sign of low B12. And it’s not reversible unless it’s caught early. And yes supplementation is key for vegans and vegetarians.
I too have never tested vitamin B6 levels as I was taught it doesn’t correlate with vitamin B6 status. I would like to understand more about B6 testing and when we see high levels and will reach out to the author of the article you link to: Kerri Knox https://www.easy-immune-health.com/Kerri-Knox.html. She is an RN and may have some additional insights. Interestingly she writes about fluroquinolone antibiotics and neuropathy here https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/peripheral-neuropathies-from-antibiotics-can-make-you-knox-rn-fmp
Thanks for adding the autoimmune/Hashimoto’s link – this paper states: “some studies report that about 25% to 42% of [hypothyroid] patients may show neuropathic clinical signs” https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24863095. There are many studies showing this connection.
I’ve seen these neuropathies in clients with all of the above root causes but not with too much B6/P5P and also not with low vitamin E. But I’m glad you mentioned vitamin E too because we have to explore all possible root causes. As you know, chemotherapy plays a role too.
Finally, it’s interesting that you only use P5P with clients – I’m still using both vitamin B6 and P5P based on each person’s response.
Hi Karla,
I’m
Not sure who your client base is but B6 toxicity is a fairly new phenomena. Toxicity is not just a product of B6 vitamins. There is B6 in Vitamin Water, Gatorade, Sports Drinks, Power Bars, Red Bull etc….. people are injesting these items in very large amounts and again as I mentioned.. this trend is new. If you’re talking a Vitamin with 500 times the RDA, eating a high B6 diet and doing Red Bull’s, B6 toxicity is highly likely. There are two Facebook Toxicity groups with thousands of people in each.. all toxic.
Hello,
I have burning mouth for about 5 weeks and was told by my dentist to get checked for all B vitamins. B6 plasma was 31.8 in excess when the range was 2.1 to 21.7. I have been tested for the MTHFR gene in 2019 and didn’t have it. I only take one vitamin that had B6 in it which was 2mg (118% daily value) and the brand was Centrum women’s multi vitamin. I read your article. If I don’t have the gene mutation and I didn’t take significant B6 in supplements, any ideas as to why I’d have excess? My dentist told me to stop the supplements and seemed sure my symptoms of burning tongue, lips and taste alterations would improve. I made the changes this week. I am worried this b6 toxicity caused permanent damage to my nerves in my mouth but I pray it’s reversible and that the damage isn’t permanent.
I was one of those unaware that B 6 was toxic and was taking a lot of it.It affected my legs and over a year I have needed a walker even in the house.I walk like a drunk.
Harold
I’m sorry to hear. How much were you taking and for how long? Have you ruled out other possible causes like low B12, gluten, Lyme disease and other possible factors? I have a family member just diagnosed with a meningioma on the spine and it’s very likely to be playing a role in his feet and leg symptoms (numbness, pain and instability). He will need surgery to remove the tumor. These tumors “forms on membranes that cover the brain and spinal cord just inside the skull. Specifically, the tumor forms on the three layers of membranes that are called meninges. These tumors are often slow-growing. As many as 90% are benign (not cancerous) https://www.webmd.com/cancer/brain-cancer/meningioma-causes-symptoms-treatment#1
I’ve had B6 toxicity twice now, at least I was tested for it and wonder now if there were other times I had it and was not tested. The first time was due to a multivitamin and an added low dose (don’t remember now what the dose was but it wasn’t over 100mg). I had a wonderful Neuro who discovered it and continued to test me until the symptoms resolved (mostly) and it no longer was in the toxic level in my bloodwork.
Fast forward to 2018 and I had it again. This time the only thing we could pin it to was Body armor drinks. 1/2 a bottle had the daily allowance of B6 and I was drinking a full bottle after my runs. I stopped the drinks and again I got better. I have noticed I can’t eat cereal anymore, the symptoms come back. Since I seem to have some type of reason that my body holds on to B6, I no longer eat bananas either. I am symptom free for the most part, I do have night sweats and can’t aleep sometimes but it may not be related to anything B6.
I do have thyroid issues and take synthroid daily. I also have lupus/mixed connective tissue disease and am stage 3 kidney failure.
I am also wondering if I have issues w holding on to potassium now as well. I started drinking coconut water as an electrolyte after a run and my kidneys have gotten worse. I know w kidney disease, I shouldn’t have too much potassium. Do you have anything to say to that? Do you know of any studies or information about potassium buildup and it causing kidney issues? If so, please email me.
I have not read through the entirety of this thread, but my family has a genetic condition that causes B6 toxicity. Without ANY supplementation, my son and I have levels approaching 500. Others with this disease are in the thousands and end up wheelchair bound. It is not reversible with the exception of an injection that is costly and still difficult to have approved or even tolerate once it is available. That being said, for those who don’t have answers I suggest checking out hypophosphatasia and the related B6 issues. It is one of those “rare” disorders that is most likely not rare, just often undiagnosed.
Chantillie
Thanks very much for sharing. Hypophosphatasia and the neuropathy connection is new to me but I just found this recent paper – Neurological symptoms in Hypophosphatasia “Bone problems occurred in 89%, dental problems in 77%, and muscle problems in 66%. Fatigue occurred in 66%, headache in 61%, sleep disturbance in 51%, gait change in 44%, vertigo in 43%, depression in 39%, anxiety in 35%, neuropathy in 35%, and hearing loss in 33%.” It also says “Although mental health diagnoses and neurological symptoms have not been previously well documented in HPP, they occur commonly.” https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30215116
Sharing this link for other blog readers – National Organization for Rare Disorders https://rarediseases.org/rare-diseases/hypophosphatasia/
From the above site: “Mutations in the ALPL gene result in insufficient levels of functional TNSALP, which, in turn, leads to the accumulation of certain chemicals in the body including phosphoethanolamine, pyridoxal 5’-phosphate, and inorganic pyrophosphate”
And as you say it seems to be undiagnosed. Also, from the above site: “The overall incidence and prevalence of all forms of HPP is unknown. Milder cases can go undiagnosed or misdiagnosed, making it difficult to determine the true frequency of HPP in the general population.”
Also from the above site, actually giving B6 is mentioned: “Vitamin B6 can help to control specific seizures in severely affected babies”
I have some questions for you if you’re willing to share so we can all learn more. Do you have mutations in the ALPL gene and how was this condition was discovered/diagnosed? I assume you also had low alkaline phosphatase (ALP) and high B6/PLP? Do you and your son have neuropathy and some of the above symptoms? Is Strensiq the injection you’re referring to? What other treatment options do you have? Have you been advised to avoid vitamin B6 in food and supplements? And do you have any online resources, events, books etc. to share on this subject?
I would like to ask you why you ask in number 7 about previous use of drugs such as benzodiazepines and antidepressants. I have prior use and prior experience in severe withdrawal from these drugs and not sure if the symptoms I have now are withdrawal from those drugs or b6 toxicity. I only took about 90 MG of b6 for 90 days at the same time I started going otno benzo withdrawal. But I have taken b complex in the past and always ate cereals etc. Just curious what the motivation for asking about the drugs was?
Ross
Benzos can lead to many physical (and emotional) withdrawal symptoms – “Tingling, numbness, altered sensation – (limbs, face, trunk)” from https://benzo.org.uk/manual/bzcha03.htm
Thank you so much for your response. Yes I definitely have experienced withdrawal. What really happened was I recovered from benzo withdrawal and then took high doses of vitamin b complex which reignited the withdrawal, which is a commonly reported phenomenon. It definitely put me back into a withdrawal state. I just couldn’t and can’t tell if my lingering symptoms are benzo withdrawal or vitamin b6 toxicity. I’m hoping it’s just psych drug withdrawal. I wish someone could tell me. My lingering symptom is a deep dull feeling in my right thigh., not unbearable, I have no tingling or burning. When the vitamins set me back into withdrawal I got severe nerve pain all over, doctors put me back onto benzodiazepines as well as other drugs and all the nerve pain stopped instantly. I stayed on the antidepressant (not the benzo) for about a year and throughout that time I never had the nerve pain. Surely antidepressants and psych drugs wouldn’t completely eradicate all the painful symptoms of vitamin b6 toxicity? Now that iv come off all the drugs over a year later the dull nerve pain in my leg has returned. I know you don’t have the definitive answers for me. Was just wondering what you thought. The trouble is I’m trying to eat to support benzo withdrawal and also trying to eat to support vitamin b6 toxicity and I’m finding it difficult, I’m losing so much wait and have to avoid so many foods and I don’t even know if it’s necessary for me to be avoiding everything.. Scared I’m making myself more silk. Thanks so much for this article.
Apologies I said I took vitamin b for 90 days, I meant I took 90mg b6 for 3 days only.
Premature exfoliation of primary teeth ( for me by age three and for my son by age 2) resulted in the ALP test, which was confirmed low. There were no other symptoms that we were aware of until this past year, when we realized many symptoms that seemed unrelated had been part of the disorder. My son is a research patient at Shriner’s Hospital in St. Louis. He is officially diagnosed with odontohypophosphatasia, because the significant bone abnormality presented in his teeth/jaw. Unfortunately, we are both complicated due to autoimmune and other congenital defects (he has Down Syndrome, celiac, singular insufficient kidney & I have Hashimoto’s) that make symptoms more difficult to distinguish when it comes to causation.
That being said, our B6 ends up both toxic and low simultaneously. The B6 is supposed to be water soluble, but our ALP level prevents the B6 from metabolizing, so we can’t use it (causing deficiency) while also having too much that cannot be removed from the body. For us, this has resulted in various enigmatic, intermittent pain and neuropathy. I also began experiencing vision issues about a year ago. My B6 was last recorded at 407, his was at 476. There is nothing that can be done to reduce it aside of Strensiq, but that is not available to cases as mild as ours. Even if it were, the side effects of a daily shot combined with so many other complications would negate any positive at this point.
For now, we eat less bananas and hope medical science can sort this out before we end up with toxic levels that would more heavily affect daily life. We do not intentionally take any supplements with vitamin B , but all our good healthy foods are full of it. So the only other option is too eat terribly unhealthy..which isn’t going to help.
Dr. Michael Whyte is the lead researcher at Shriner’s Hospital Metabolic Research Unity in St. Louis. If you pull up any medical journal with key words (Hypophosphatasia, B6), you will likely find the ever growing number of published medical journals. The articles are NOT for lay people though. I highly recommend that people get additional information on the disorder if reducing B6 in supplementation and diet does not result in an acceptable tested B6 range.
There was a lot of good info here and a lot of good questions.
My particular Problem is I get toxic levels of B6 without supplements. I don’t know why my body stores b6 and doesn’t pee it out. I also have a deficiency in B12 and I have a good iron storage but I can’t seen to turn that to ferritin.
I have a healthy diet and I also have an autoimmune. JRA as a child.
I’m very stumped as to why my body can’t seem to process these things.
My symptoms have been nerve pain in feet, hands, arms. Muscle pain in hips, shoulders. Numbing in face, arms, fingers, and feet.
Twitching in feet and other muscles throughout the body.
I’ve had this for several years and not much has changed it or made it better.
Jodi
Sorry to hear this. It’s important to address low B12 as this can cause neuropathy. With autoimmunity and pain I also have all my clients address diet and remove gluten and often dairy and all grains too. I would suggest working with a functional medicine practitioner and working thru the other 1-14 possible causes I write about in the blog
You can get toxic from what you are eating and drinking. Check your labels. Are you eating energy bars or drinking energy drinks. There is synthetic B6 is so many things and you don’t even know you are consuming it.
Hi Trudy,
I’m a 29 year old male and I started Tyrosine and B-Vitamin Complex when I was 25 just starting my professional career. It’s interesting that I am running into this article because my life has turned upside down since I started those two supplements. I have suffered from almost 3 years of severe insomnia, gastrointestinal trouble, constant internal vibrations, never ending tinnitus, and anxiety/depressive issues ever since. I broke up with a woman I loved because my will was incredibly broken at the time. My professional trajectory was derailed as I was struggling everyday to overcome my issues. Now I never had these physical issues prior to taking those two supplements and I have subsided taking these two supplements over two years ago but the problems are still persisting. It’s interesting with all the anecdotal evidence here suggesting that B6 toxicity can have long term repercussions and I feel like I’m suffering from that right now. Now I am seeing some improvements since I’ve been practicing grounding myself but it’s still an issue. And it’s been over three years already! I just wish I could go back in time and never take begin taking those supplements. If there is any insight you have on how to recover from B6 toxicity–especially the long term effects–I would love to get in touch with you.
Vin if you are on Facebook there are two groups with lots of info: Exploring B6 Toxicity and Healing B6 Toxicity. There are thousands and thousands of people with this issue.
I took 100 mg of p5p for over 5 years. I developed monoclonal gammopathy and small fiber nueropathy. I have had fibromyalgia for 26 years and this was really hard to have to deal with these issues. I have no idea if that much b6 caused any of these issues, but I went from being ok with the fibromyalgia to facing debilitating dying nerve pain and am being tested for Multiple Myeloma for three years now . I can’t find a doctor to help me with any of this and if anyone knows of a good doctor who can sort all of this out in the Portland Oregon area I am so open. Thanks for any suggestions.
Jane
I’m sorry to hear this. I consider 100mg of P5P a high amount and start my clients on 25mg. It would be very helpful for us to try and unwind some of thisif you would be kind enough to answer the 15 questions I pose.
Have you worked with a naturopath?
Yes, I have. He is the one who put me on it. He then went on to do other things and I had to work with his replacement. I have been trying for 3 years to get help both with a neurologist and a naturopathic doctor. I am a tough customer, because I over react to everything. Foods and supplements seem to be my enemy. I was on B1, MTHFR 5 mg, P5P and other things and just stopped it all. I don’t know what works or what doesn’t. I’m also gluten free and histamine free. I’m looking for a good ND or a functional medicine doctor, but no luck. I wish I knew how to detox from the years of P5P. I stopped it this past year, but the neuropathy hasn’t budged. I also took B12 shots for years. I’m thinking the preservative might have been an issue.
I am suffering from b6 toxicity from taking 125-150mg pyridoxine per day & 100mg P5P per day for 3 1/2 years. My doctor is surprised & levels have never been checked before. I have 6 times the highest recommended blood level (1110).
I have pyroluria & have taken all kinds of antidepressants in the past 20 years including SSRI’s. I have experienced amazing recovery with nutrient therapy until recently. I now have this b6 toxicity still causing me problems after ceasing to take it 2 months ago. I have also reacted to methionine – anxiety & heart palpitations.
Has anyone else experienced this kind of thing.
Ma
Some good info regarding b6 toxicity…..
https://www.easy-immune-health.com/vitamin-b6-toxicity.html
https://mthfrsupport.com.au/2018/11/vitamin-b6-mthfr/
Hi – I am starting to panic after reading all of this. I have had muscle twitching and tingling for several years and was taking high doses of b complex vitamins at the recommendation of a doctor- who thought it would help. I was told to up my magnesium and potassium recently as this has gotten so bad. I just saw a neurologist who has just tested my B6 and I should get results shortly. I’m convinced now that this is my issue. What are the best ideas for detoxing and can the effects be reversed???
Hi Teresa —
I became toxic after changing my multi-vitamin to a women’s “over 50” multi-vitamin with 25mg synthetic B6. Unfortunately, it took more than a year after my symptoms began (and then elevated) to get a correct diagnosis.
When you remove the source of the B6, you stop the ongoing source of damage. However, you need to then recover from the damage to your nerves. Nerves heal very (very) slowly. The physician who diagnosed me told me to think in terms of one to two years (I would add another year for me personally, but the general timing was correct). Things will get better gradually (and sometimes it will feel like two steps forward, one step back).
Things that helped — staying hydrated (drinking reasonable, but not bizarre, amounts of water) , acupuncture, exercise and (early on) avoiding high-B6 foods. In terms of this last item — for some time, I avoided avocado (as one example) even though I love it because it seemed to exacerbate symptoms. Over time, I have been able to gradually reintroduce these kinds of foods.
After four years, I no longer have any kind of regular symptoms. I can still experience some tingles, internal trembles, “zaps” when I get overly tired, stressed or dehydrated — but life is much (much) better now.
THANK YOU so much! This gives me hope. It also gives me a realistic timeline. It’s odd for me because my symptoms can ‘come and go’. Were yours consistent or did you have times when they were really bad and times when they were gone? I wish I had known what was causing this because I would take high does of a Bcomplex when I was ‘stressed’ which just made everything bad. Such an odd thing…I wish doctors were aware! You have helped me a LOT. Thank you so much!
Hi Teresa —
One of the hallmarks (I think) of B6 issues versus other neurological diseases is the fact that it is random and moves around — so, for awhile you might have internal trembles in your right leg — then your left leg. Then you might have a warm patch on a leg — then tingles in your right hand. I might fixate on some issue (e.g., numbness on the bottom of my right big toe) for several days — only to realize that the toe was back to normal and something ELSE was tingling, vibrating, numb or warm.
While there is very little that is “normal” about B6 issues :), I think that that kind of presentation IS normal for this issue.
I’ve been reading as much as I can find on this issue. I really have NO idea how long I’ve really had this as mine has ‘come and gone’ at certain times. I would go through a period of stress and increase my Vitamin B complex only to have more issues (mine are muscles twitches in my legs and tingling in arms and legs). then they would stop for awhile. Exercise seemed to make the twitching worse. Recently I ended up in the ER because my whole body felt like it was on fire. I went to the ER doc and 2 other docs who all told me to ‘take more magnesium and potassium and drink more water’. The whole time I was increasing my vitamin B because I thought it was stress related. I THOUGHT I had figured out that this was caused by an intolerance to sugar substitutes, but was finally able to get into a neurologist who said it is B6. I am so ANGRY that all those doctors missed this and one was even recommending increases in B-complex vitamins. I stopped taking my B6 right after seeing the neurologist, and I read that there is a 1-3 week period called ‘coasting’ where the symptoms may stay the same or even worsen. Before I read your reply about foods, I had gone out for dinner and had a salad with: avocado, bacon, eggs and chicken…all high in B6. I was miserable that night. I’m taking your advice regarding watching my foods and yesterday was WAY better. (The hard part is that EVERYTHING has B6! 🙂 Did you ever take ALA? Alpha Lipoic Acid supplement? It’s supposed to help nerve regeneration and reduce inflammation?
Hi all,
I have just discovered I have a B6 toxicity after taking P5P for 7 months this.
The typical symptons increased upon recovering from covid, not sure if this is just coincidence or that the liver was struggling from a viral infection thus “triggered” the toxixcity symptons.
I also have blurry vision, so I can see, drive, read etc, but objects are not as sharp as before with a lot of floaters … I have had my eyes scanned by a specialist with no cause for concern from their point if view.
Has anyone experienced blurred vision after Vit B6 reaction?
Trudy,
I really need your help.
I took one dose of p5p one night and it made me go crazy.
I am pregnant and my glucose was impaired. I say two studies in which they gave pregnant women 100 mg of vitamin b6 and there blood sugar readings improved tremendously.
One night my reading was 200 mg/dl and I panicked. I took 100 mg of p5p, but actually I took more 120 mg because I miscalculated. After an hour I started feeling not so well. I experienced severe insomnia, and today I really feel like I am going crazy. I really crazy. I am so scared. I cannot sleep anymore. What have I done. Who would have thought that it could have such a reaction.
Did I mess up my baby and my body for life?
I am so scared.
What can I do?
Chana…are you feeling better? My symptoms went away quickly, but I’ve noticed they come and go a bit still..but getting progressively better. Try to stay calm…I know I panicked and it doesn’t help. Try to meditate …try Headspace…it’s an app that is awesome. I suggest that you also see a neurologist if you are not seeing results… It took mine about 10 minutes to figure out what is going on.
I wanted to say that taking zinc has helped me tremendously.
I contacted a nutritionist via facebook and I thought the vitamin b6 caused problems with copper and zinc, he suggested taking zinc, so I started taking zinc. I had zinc lozenges laying around. I took 10 mg at night and it helped me calm down a little bit. I could go to bed for a few hours, which was impossible before.
Today I took more zinc (20 mg) and I feel well now.
Apparently vitamin b6 and especially P5P is involved in the urea cycle, and can raise ammonia levels. Some people have trouble clearing ammonia levels due to various reasons. When ammonia becomes too high, your brain and nervous system suffers tremendously. It is very neurotoxic. I think that this is what caused my severe reaction to p5p. Zinc lowers blood ammonia level because it increases a certain enzyme in the liver which is needed for clearing ammonia.
So that is probably why orthomolecular doctors describe them together. Vitamin b6 can cause hyperammonia is certain people, for example those with certain conditions or with genetic problems in the urea cycle, zinc deficiency can cause hyperammonia.
Actually hyperammonia can cause nerve damage. So maybe that is what vitamin b6 toxicity is: hyperammonia. You can look up zinc and hyperammonia in scientific articles. Quite scary. So given my remarkable improvement to zinc I think this is what happened.
I was really going insane, and high levels of ammonia can really make a person go insane. I think I am sensitive to it, maybe I have a problem with my urea cycle? Or maybe I needed more zinc. Will continue to take zinc for awhile. Also zinc is really good for your gut, and ammonia can increase due to gut infections or bacteria. So it probably has a double action against ammonia.
I became toxic two years ago and have not been able to improve it. There are thousands of us in a support group on facebook: Healing B6 Toxicity with Western Research. This has been devastating. https://www.facebook.com/search/top/?q=healing%20b6%20toxicity%20w%2Fwestern%20research&epa=SEARCH_BOX
What were/are your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues?
I became b6 toxic from a prenatal vitamin with 25 mg pyridoxine, taken for 7.5 years (four pregnancies in a row, and through nursing). My symptoms began 12-18 months into supplementation with massive anxiety and then vision and vestibular issues. Also hypoglycemia (this has much improved with careful diet and I’m unsure if it’s even related, but no one can explain it and I’m not diabetic or prediabetic and don’t have insulin resistance), low potassium randomly in a pregnancy despite no kidney or other issue, heart palpitations (full cardiac workup normal), light sensitivity, sensation of being off balance (no falling or weakness), hearing distortion (no hearing loss, was tested). My last symptoms were the burning and tingling, burning mouth, etc which finally led me to discover b6 toxicity. I went to countless doctors and specialists (ent, cardio, neuro) and was extensively monitored for possible thyroid issues with full thyroid panels including antibodies (nope, no issue). Finally I sleuthed the internet one night and then ordered my own b6 lab work at a walk in lab place. Results showed toxicity. Neurologist agreed and attributed my symptoms to it. To this day, I have been diagnosed with no other condition.
Have you resolved the symptoms and if yes how?
Some of my symptoms have resolved. Limb tingling, vision and vestibular issues 90% better in about six months, anxiety also much better. Focusing on electrolytes has helped me the most, exercise a close second.
Did you make any other changes around the same time i.e. stopping and/or other nutritional support?
Stopped the offending vitamin of course. Increased my electrolyte intake, mainly increasing salt and potassium. Also stopped all supplements within about two weeks of stopping the b6 supplement. Years ago, I ditched gluten and then all grains from my diet.
Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking?
pyridoxine
And how much did you take and how often?
25 mg daily for 7.5 years
If you have pyroluria were you also taking zinc and how much? (Dr. Pfeiffer recommended taking zinc together with vitamin B6).
n/a
Past history or current use of medications like benzodiazepines (such as Ativan, Xanax, valium etc.), gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP / birth control pill, SSRIs /antidepressants (such as Prozac, Celexa, Lexapro, Paxil, Zoloft etc.), fluroquinolone antibiotics (such as ciprofloxacin/Cipro, gemifloxacin/Factive, levofloxacin/Levaquin, moxifloxacin/Avelox, norfloxacin/Noroxin and ofloxacin/Floxin), PPIs (proton pump inhibitors such as Nexium for heart-burn), diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc.?
I took bcp for probably 2-3 months at most about 7 years prior to supplementing b6. I took levaquin once, about a year before I began supplementing b6. I remember it made me feel ill and I’m not sure if I finished the rx, but definitely took some.
What kind of EMF exposure do you have – WiFi in the home and/or at work, how much cell phone use in a day, cordless phones at home and/or work and a smart meter at home? Wifi everywhere I go basically, cell phone is with me all day.
What kind of exposure have you had to GMOs and pesticides (i.e. do you only eat organic food), glyphosate (eg. Roundup exposure from lawns, golf courses, parks etc.), plastics/phthalates (do you avoid plastics)?
I do eat 90% organic or better, well sourced meats and eggs, extremely limited organic dairy. But this is within the last 5 years. Prior, I ate total garbage honestly.
What polymorphisms do you have: cytochrome P450 polymorphisms (we know some of these make benzodiazepines more toxic and more difficult to taper in about 60% of those prescribed these meds), and/or MTHFR polymorphism (may affect our detox ability if it’s expressing) and others you know about?
mthfr heterozygous a667
Did you take a B complex (or a multivitamin that contains all the B vitamins) with the vitamin B6?
Did you also take magnesium with the vitamin B6 and if yes how much? (Bernie Rimland reported that taking vitamin B6 together with magnesium resulted in an improved behavior of ASD (autism spectrum patients))
Have you observed any correlation with intake of dietary oxalates i.e. worsening symptoms when consuming medium or high oxalate foods (such as spinach, kale, berries, nuts, kiwi fruit, eggplant etc.) or using vitamin C or milk thistle, and less severe symptoms when consuming a low oxalate diet? (Susan Owens is founder of http://www.lowoxalate.info and shares that vitamin B6 is the most efficacious vitamin for reducing oxalates and that we also don’t know if the classic signs of vitamin B6 toxicity has anything to do with oxalate dumping symptoms.)
I took b6 in a prenatal multivitamin that contained several other things, but not b12. I did take it with magnesium citrate 600 mg/day, but stopped the magnesium after b6 toxicity was diagnosed. Whenever I attempt to restart it or any other magnesium, my b6 symptoms flare. I don’t notice correlation with high oxalate foods, but I probably haven’t been paying close attention to that either.
Do you have a thyroid disease? “peripheral diseases frequently include polyneuropathy”
No
Have you been diagnosed with an autoimmune condition and if yes, which one?
No, though it’s been extensively looked for.
Just started taking b6 3 weeks ago ready to get off have a little anxiety and sensation
Maybe the symptoms reported are related to copper dumping, vit b6 being a copper antagonist. Particularly the folks that report emotional symptoms aka going crazy. Copper converts dopamine into norepinephrine and wreaks havoc in the brain. The effects are very scary especially if you dont know your copper levels.
One needs to know all the mineral levels, not just copper. Copper is also needed to make iron bio-available in the body so iron is not stored in organs (oxidative stress). Check all mineral levels: potassium, magnesium RBC, copper, chloride, sodium,
Vitamin B6 is as you say a copper antagonist and as such it may in time deplete levels of this vital metal. The problems you talk about though, seem as likely to be caused by copper deficiency, as they are by copper dumping as our bodies are usually very efficient at getting rid of excess copper.
Deficiency of of copper maybe widespread and amongst other things, it causes symptoms which can mirror those which are being ascribed to vitamin B6 toxicity. Here then is a possible reason why vitamin B6 supplementation may affect some people and not others. In this regard those with higher copper intakes or stores could likely be more resistant to problems caused by excessive B6.
Trudy,
I’ve experienced some of the symptoms of b6 toxicity after taking 100mg pyridoxine in just 4 days.
So I tried P5P and all the negative effects were gone, actually, it worked great for my anxiety and mood issues.
I think It’s possible that some individuals, due to genetic factors, can only use b6 on the active form.
Since pyridoxine and P5P competes for the same receptors, adding more pyridoxine would only increase the deficiency, causing vitamin b6 deficiency symptoms, which are very similar to the toxicity symptoms.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/28716455/
If so, these cases of vitamin b6 toxicity would actully be vitamin b6 deficiency, and these symptoms could improve after supplementing P5P.
Thank you for reading, hope It’s helpful
Just to clarify…..are you saying….. if your blood toxicity levels are very high with B6 ( as shown in a laboratory blood test), I could be deficient in B6? Since I have suffered greatly from many debilitating symptoms….many of which have gone away after stopping B6 supplementation…I would be fearful of taking any form of B6. My question is still….. if lab tests show very high levels of B6 in my blood, I can still be deficient in B6?
I have NO IDEA how that could be true. If your blood test says you are HIGH in B6, your body is HIGH IN B6 – STOP taking it. Be careful about foods that are high in B6. You could be deficient in other B vitamins (like B12- which a LOT of people are deficient in). However, I would make sure you are working with a doctor and only supplement based on your blood test. I think that the note above means that some people can only handle B6 that enters the body through FOOD and not supplements. After my blood test showed I was high in B6, I was very careful not to eat foods high in it for awhile. Once you study how many foods are high in B6, I think you will see that there is no reason to ever supplement that form again.
Hi Teresa,
Yes, it is logical that if your lab tests show high b6, then one would say it is so. I have simply heard comments on this site that low levels could cause the same symptoms, even though the person submitted the fact that their levels of b6 were elevated (creating some confusion).
I am 2 years into my recovery from b6 toxicity, and ceasing any synthetic b6 supplementation ( or any form of b6) but continue to have Xerostomia and burning mouth syndrome. Iam still being treated by my neurologist who has prescribed gabapentin. I also add R-lipoic acid ( the best form). This is a miserable condition, and one for which I pray someone would have a solution.
Thanks for continuing on site.
I have had a headache 24/7 for 20 that was triggered by taking b complex vitamin. Doctors find this unbelievable because obviously the Vitamins are water-soluble. However, that does not change the fact it happened. The reason i am convinced this is true is because i can reproduce the severity of my headaches by taking b-complex.
Hi Lionel…I had to go to a neurologist to figure out what was going on with me. It was vitamin B6 toxicity (which I didn’t realize was ‘a thing’ because I’d been told that B vitamins are water soluble). HOWEVER, for SOME PEOPLE, B6 is NOT. You can have a test done to determine your B6 level. Normal is 25-125 and mine was 450 when I was first tested. B6 specifically. Different people have different symptoms. Mine were muscle twitching and muscle cramping (mostly in my legs). Just don’t take B complex. You most likely can take B12, but don’t take anything with B6. You should get MORE than enough with a healthy diet.
Teresa, I’ve never heard of muscle cramping in your legs due to vit B 6 toxicity? I’ve heard of the numbness and twitching. Could it not be possible that your potassium and magnesium is out of balance? Usually muscle cramping is due to these two minerals.
Thanks so much Teresa. Did you do anything in a particular to remedy the toxicity? Personally my twitching and cramping were in my facial and muscles around my head. Taking transdermal magnesium has been my greatest help to date.
Hi Lionell- I was VERY careful not to take anything with B6 in it (and there are a lot of supplements – even my magnesium that i was taking- had B6 in it (read labels!). Also, I stopped eating B6 rich foods for a bit (which can be hard because a lot of food has B6 (spinach seems to be my worst offender). I’m feeling better and better and it’s only been about 3-4 months for me since I stopped the B6 and I don’t really watch the food much anymore. I think everyone is different tho and I saw that some people took up to 4 years to recover fully. I still get twitches and cramps periodically but RARELY and nothing like what I had. In addition, I tool Alphalipoic acid for a bit (you can get it at any drug store- like Walgreens). I’m glad you are better. This is the weirdest thing and not may suffer from it…and only a neurologist was able to tell me about it (my other doctors had no clue). I hope you get better FAST!!!! 🙂
My daughter has tardive dyskinesia and seems to be responding well to 275mg of P5P three times per day plus BCAA three times per day. Also give her magnesium at night. I know the dose is off the charts, so I will cut down the dose drastically. I know I should be co-supplementing with methylated Bs – they are on order. What else can I do to reduce her risk of B6 toxicity? Would liver supports help?
Hello –
I have high b6 serum level without taking any b6 in any supplements. I was advised to take p5p for this. Does this make sense? That I may instead need active b6? Note that I am mthfr homozygous. B12 in 400s and slightly low normal folate but homocysteine and methylmalonic acid are fine. Thanks!!
Dear Trudy Scott,
Thank you a lot for opening this space for posting personal experiences on B6 supplementation. Hope my comment can benefit this discussion.
I used to have anxiety and depression, and most of the pyroluria symptoms. I also recently been diagnosed with b6 responsive anemia (yellow skin, high iron and ferritin, low b6 symptoms)
Initially, when I started taking 50-100mg P5P (I felt worse on Pyridoxine) my symptoms almost vanished (including my many food sensitivies) and I felt better than ever.
Unfortunatelly, most of the benefits I’ve experienced slowly faded away.
I’m still feeling better than before, but since that (3 months ago) I’ve been trying to recreate these health benefits:
•I’ve added a high quality multivitamin
•I’ve tried to increase zinc(60mg)/reduce zinc(15mg)
•I’ve mixed pyridoxine with P5P (200mg/50mg)
•I’ve added a b100 complex
But I’m still unable to replicate the benefits.
After doing some research, I got curious if supplementing with Pyridoxamine could be a potential solution for solving some vitamin B6 mysteries, such as what I’ve experienced and vitamin B6 toxicity: maybe these vitamins are all necessary and compete for the same receptors. This way, for some individuals (genetic factors) adding too much of one type “wreck” the balance.
What do you think?
Thank you so much for your attention.
I finally find out how to make B6 work for me again!
Before that, I kept taking the same supplements (including P5P) but my health was deteriorating. I had symptoms of strong nerve pain, blurred vision and a panic attack (I never had any of this before).
All these symptoms only subsided when I started taking the active form of folate (200mcg/day).
In few days, I started feeling much more alive, with increased energy levels, less anxiety, and now everything looks more vibrant. So I knew it worked.
This study (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11592449) suggests that B6 supplementation increases folate requirements. So, even if I was not B6 deficient anymore (when taking only P5P), I’ve had become B9 deficient.
Interestingly, according to some sources (https://ada.com/conditions/folate-deficiency/) B9 deficiency can also cause peripheral neuropathy.
I’ve tried B-complex 100 in the past but it didn’t work. For me, it HAS to be the methyl-folate product.
Not everyone needs folate in the active form, BUT that’s a possible explanation for negative reactions with b6 supplements (specially P5P).
For those with similar symptoms, I recommend trying it, or discussing this with your practioner.
Now my main supplements are magnesium (450mg), zinc (30mg), P5P (50mg), and a B-complex with 200mcg of methyl-folate (Life Extension brand). I think It’s better to take an active B-complex than individual folate to reduce the risk of creating new imbalances.
Supplementation is highly individual, I’m just sharing what worked for me and could work for some people with similar issues.
Hope this is helpful
Hi Frank,
Since high B6 serum levels can cause a long list of health issues, many debilitating and painful, I think I would just avoid any added B6 in any form. Keep in mind there is B6 in 75% of our diets. And, as long as you screen for the added synthetic form, you should get what you need (less than 2 mg a day ) Even though you didn’t take a synthetic form in a supplement, synthetic b6 is added to many foods, and especially power/ and energy drinks. I understand P5P, supposedly, doesn’t cause the same dangerous rise in b6 toxicity, but I’d look to consuming whole foods which are without added synthetic b6.
Of course, with your special gene proclivity, I would follow the advice of your medical advisor.
Obs: I didn’t tested pyridoxamine yet because the only brand I found doesn’t ship to my country (Brazil). But I will test and communicate the results as soon as I can.
I would love to know your reaction to pyridoxamine and if anyone else with b6 toxicity responds well to this form.
Lucas,
B6 LOWERS FOLATE. Stop the B6, increase the folate…
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1647812/pdf/archdisch00869-0060.pdf
Thank God I found this website!!
I’ve just been diagnosed with B6 toxicity after a long period of time on p5p for Pyroluria. I would seriously like some more information on this and also help with the research of collecting data.
Julie, there are two Facebook pages with thousands of people who have B6 Toxicity. They are called Exploring B6 Toxicity and Healing B6 Toxicity. I think you will fine them very helpful.
Since this was written over a year and half ago, have there been any updates? Are you any closer to figuring out what’s going on here? Thank you!
Claire
I’m afraid I still don’t have answers
Hi,
I wonder if taking B6 maybe blocks B12 from working in some people’s bodies, and that is why it causes the nerve issues. Just a thought.
I’m so glad this forum and active community is available. Thanks Trudy!. There aren’t too many resources out there on this topic.
I was recently diagnosed with high b6, 5x the normal level. I don’t normally take supplements, but had taken a multi-vitamin that had 75mg pyridoxine HCL. Thankfully my neurologist caught it quickly enough via blood test for me to discontinue. There is an obvious cause and effect as was healthy prior to supplementing. I had only taken it for 3-4 weeks, but have been suffering greatly. Started with anxiety, nocturnal panic attacks with horrific dreams that turned into insomnia. Then vision issues, numbness and tingling in hands, feet, forearms, legs, head and neck. Also developed balance/gait, coordination issues, bone pain in shins, muscle stiffness and joint pian, weakness/tremors on exertion. And not derealization but some kind of reduced form of consciousness.. Maybe it’s a form of never ending headache? The one thing that has gotten better since ceasing is the anxiety and sleep issues.
Maybe I have derivated from the other topics of this forum but am grateful people have been bold enough to share thier stories and insights. As I do now. I am still in shock.
I was diagnosed with B6 toxicity late last year. My level was around 450. I was having serious muscle twitching in my legs and one night ended up in the ER because my skin was ‘burning’ so badly that I felt I was on fire. I had been to several doctors, previously, and kept being told to take magnesium and drink more fluids. The ER did some blood tests and sent me home, telling me to hydrate. I finally got into a neurologist because all the websites suggested I had ALS or MS (of course I was panicking at this point). It took my neurologist all of 10 minutes to tell me it was most likely Vitamin B6 toxicity and to get tested. She was right.
I am wondering 2 things:
1) At first I was careful not to eat foods high in B6 (which are many) and I found if I ate too many, symptoms returned – has anyone else had that experience?
2) I can go for periods of time and not have twitching and then it shows up again randomly (not severe), but has anyone else experienced this?
Self awareness finally confirmed that I may have experienced B-6 over load! I ended up going to Urgent Care, but without a blood test, they turned me to discussing this with my doctor. After explaining the symptoms – left arm numbness, tingling, twitching, hand and feet numbness on left side, lower calf tightness. However, did not experience headaches, but did have some mental issues i.e. crying for no real reason and confused most of the time. I was diagnosed with OCD years ago and feel I may have created this problem on my own. I’m normally a healthy woman, currently going on 50 years old and never experienced anything like this. As I searched online, I noticed the problem immediately. I have B-6 in at least 5 products/supplements I take on a daily basis. The amounts are extreme, as some have 2,000%, and almost the same for the others! I feel lucky almost identifying with this knowledge and think my OCD may have tempted me to think B vitamins are always good for you; I hear it all the time with women my age, so I over did this, but only on and off for under a year! The day I decided to visit urgent care, I stopped all supplements with B-6 and have felt much better since; it only took 1 day but after a week, felt the difference. Now, I supplement only with 1 of the 5 that includes B-6 daily, because that 2000% is way over the recommended daily dose anyway. So far, so good, but will begin taking this every other day while I eat healthy and probably absorb enough B-6 and other B vitamins through the foods I eat. So many foods contain B vitamins and unless you are told you are deficient, is the only time to supplement, or possibly a medical condition doesn’t allow B vitamins to absorb well in your system, this again would be the only reason to ever take B vitamins. Blood work says it all, but with the conditions of COVID right now, I’ll hold off until my annual screening in December.
Hi Carrie….
I had the same issue with B6. I would advise taking NO supplements with B6. You will also have to watch other processed foods and even beverages (for example, some drink mixes, sport drinks, etc have it). You should be able to get MORE than enough B6 from healthy foods. As a matter of fact, I had to watch the food I ate at first because some are so high in B6 that it would trigger my symptoms. You CAN still take B12 and I would recommend it. B6 is the culprit. I went to a neurologist to finally get it figured out. Again…I would suggest you cut it out in ANY supplements. You don’t need it from them! I still have symptoms that come back once in awhile…and I’m not sure why. I think it takes quite awhile to eliminate the issue. So glad you figured this out. It took me a long time.
I am skeptical that I have this condition although a Cleveland Clinic doctor has told me I do. I have had painful fingertips for about 2 years and pain in my ankles, hands, about that long with low fevers and night sweats. I started take Biotin Forte a year ago when my hair was coming out in clumps and started flying off of me in the wind. My hairdresser said I was getting a Bald spot (I am an active, runner, athlete coach, very fit). I took this OTC supplement (the one with NO iron, and 25 mg b6 plus other B vitamins and minerals which improved my hair loss noticeably after 2 months. Then I took it intermittently because basically, I forgot, but then after a week or so my hair would stare my shedding., and I would remember. Over the course of this year I have had several episodes where I thought I had the flu and the last one was severe. My body hurt all over and I had shooting pains almost everywhere,severe headache, fever. This was March 2020 and so I couldn’t get to see a doctor. After improving form these episodes I continued to become increasingly weak and could no longer run or so push ups, even one (used to do 25 +a day). I usually can not lift my right arm and sometimes my right foot won’t lift. My left foot is half numb. Washing a few dishes now leaves me breathless and my arms and legs hurt all the time. I started falling (June )when I lost control at my sacroiliac joint (right) and also my left knee. In afternoons I could not grip things, drop things. I now have chronic diarrhea after years of chronic constipation.
(For almost a year). My low blood pressure is now high. Recent Bloods showed high B6, all others vitamins in the low side of normal, EXCEPT high E, but another (metabolized? ) E was low. High magnesium and chlorine. Positive ANA TEST! So why does the doctor say it’s the OTC supplement I take occasionally? No other meds but for some steroids since falling and for the pain. 3 times, recently. I don’t feel better after 2 weeks off OTC Biotin Forte (was taking it about 3 times a week.) Most symptoms started before the B6 anyway, and wondering why we’re t the other vitamins (like b12) also high ? B6 was about double the normal. No explanation for the positive ANA and diarrhea (about 10-20 times a day) make no sense how they fit in. I think he is wrong. He says I have B6 toxicity.
My B6 levels were off the charts at more than 2000. I have had “awful” symptoms. I have taken supplements with B6 but the total was around 100 mg. I’m not convinced that the supplements alone caused this. Any advice is greatly appreciated
Hi.
I suspect I might have Pylouria and using p5p and zinc and primrose oil. Thanks for all the info on your website!
After seeing two neurologists & full work-up for MS, neuro-Lyme, small fiber neuropathy, you name it – MRIs, nerve biopsy, two EMGS, two nerve conduction studies, CBC – all negative – I had no diagnosis. Just lots of pain (intercostal neuralgia) and foot numbness, plus rashes & welts. Was taking my daily B Complex and husband asked for one. He said he takes only one a week because there the doses are so much higher than the RMD. Figuring that the B vitamins are water soluble, I thought well that’s not a problem. But hey, google is free and I’m desperate. Within 10 min, learned about pyridoxine neurotoxicity. Perfect match. Stopped taking the B complex that day. Had my blood plasma level tested. Got results today. It is 78 – more than twice the upper reference level of 32. Spent day writing to the manufacturer, primary care physician, both neurologists, the Institute of Medicine, the NIH. Will write to the American Board of Psychiatrists and Neurologists tomorrow. I am so ticked that the neurologists didn’t consider this even tho I gave them list of every supplement with doses. Ticked at myself for being so careless with my health. I have had nearly seven months of severe, constant pain and anxiety about having a condition with no diagnosis and worried that it would be progressive/permanent w/out treatment. Praying that it will gradually resolve on its own. Doing a deep dive into the neurology of the dorsal root ganglion and the ability of the soma to regenerate.
To answer your questions – taking no Rx meds of any kind. Other supplements – D3, 81 mg aspirin, SOD w/ Gliodin, ALA + Acetyl L-Carnitine, and sea buckthorn oil. And probiotics. Have no idea what the EMF exposure might be.
I just started taking P5P and zinc and primrose for borderline Pyroluria. Hope to gain more info from this site.
Hi Trudy
Wauw such an amount of reactions. I’ve had paratyphoid as a little child. I had some issues in my youth with throat infections belly aches minor anxiety but more or less ok. My issues started after a trip to India. Diarrhea parasites ? Fluorquinolone Metronidazole all in 2001 hay fever food intolérances colonoscopy. Tonsils removed at 34. At 35 underweight foodintolerances sky high. I got better with lapacho l. Rhamnosus GG and vit b complex baxters. 3 years better miscarriage with anesthesie for curetage and then in 2013 foodpoisoning tick bite and neighbour’s spraying Hugh amount of glyphosate. Feeling really stressed foodintolerance Mcs palpitations hyperventilation. After hay season and after neighbor stopped spraying things calmed down a bit. I started work in 10 hours per week again. But than January 2014 I got tummy flu that lasted for weeks and when it finally stopped I had this pain like a fireball in my back. I thought it must be Lyme. I took 2 weeks of teasel and got cluster headache. I went. To à doctor who gave me a supplement wit tryptofaan b6 and vit c and it got even worse. I was put in a psychiatric institute but actually I was fysically very ill and very underweight so they thought I had anorexia or orthorexia with psychosis. It’s almost funny but at the time it was horrible. Luckily in the psychosis department was a psychologist who said no way you have psychosis maybe you have fibromyalgia. Afterwards I got a bit better by working on my bowels and lymf but this fireball did’nt completely go. My Lyme numbers were not zero and I still had a lot of issues with pain chronic fatigue numbness of my arms so in 2018 I did a parasitic artemisia course of 3 weeks and buhner protocol of 2 months and had another crisis. When that passed months later. A new doctor in 2019 said I think you have hpu/kryptopyrrollactamurie. You have to take copper vitamin c and vitamin b6. Also because I have histamine issues. Did I notice that!!! It was only 6mg of p5p and I took zinc and manganese too. I took it for 3 days. I instantly lost weight. Stomach and bowel aches. Anxiety. A lot of pain. When I mean losing weight I mean very fast from 50 to 45 kilo. For 1.71m. I think it is bmi 15. My body definitely wanted to get rid of something. This summer I took some tests bacteriophag test for Lyme. There was none. I did a microbiome test I had an excess of Desulfovibrio. Akkermansia. Alistipes Oscillibacter and Dientamoeba fragilis. Very low Siga. I am also testing for genes SUOX CBS and NOS3. I think there is a link between an impaired sulfuration pathway and b6.
I also see a link with bowel inflammation liver disease. glyphosate stress benzo’s sulfur food. Genetics gut microbiome…..
Thanks for reading all our stories. I wasn’t able to read them all but I a sure we can learn from all these symptoms and events. Best greetings Evy from Belgium.
I have had adverse reactions to P-5-P at “safe” doses. I lost the feeling of the tip of my tongue, and that was really scary. I took less than 100 mg together with 400 mg Magnesium Bisglycinate. It resolved in a couple days after stopping.
Recently I took 60 mg P-5-P in a day along with 1500 mg Vit C and 800 Magnesium Citrate, trying to prevent a migraine. I got a severe migraine with strong nausea, tingling in the tip of my tongue, and changes in my thinking along with vivid dreams.
I was wondering what might cause someone to have such a severe reaction to such low and unrepeated doses. I thought maybe it had to do with the co-enzymated form?
I take a daily multivitamin that has Vit. B6 as Pyridoxine Hydrochloride 1.7 mg and that doesn’t bother me.
I also have hypothyroidism and take 100mg levothyroxine. Although never diagnosed with Hashimotos, two years ago my TPO antibodies were 15, so technically Hashimotos. But recently my TPO antibodies were at 6.
I eat non-gmo, organic food, dairy free, gluten free, soy free, caffeine free, alcohol free, low histamine diet. I have not yet looked into the MTHFR gene variation, but suspect that could be an issue. I also want to find out if my histamine intolerance and menstrual migraines are from Mast Cell Activation Syndrome.
But taking B6 as P-5-P isn’t something I will take again!
I have recently been diagnosed with HPP ( Hypophosphatemia). My ALP levels are very low and B6 is high. This is a disease where the liver doesn’t do what it is supposed to. I think a lot more people have this condition than know about it. I had never heard of it until I was diagnosed. It keeps calcium from going to your bones and instead goes into joints and other places it’s not supposed to, so you don’t want to take calcium supplements, it also causes B6 levels to be high ( even without taking supplements, which you do not want to do). Didn’t know if this disease was something that anyone here has ever checked into to see if this could be part of problem if you have high B6 levels. It is a very rare genetic disorder, a lot of people get misdiagnosed with fibromyalgia and osteoporosis when they really have this disease. Thank you
I have recently had to blood tests come back with elevated B6. I don’t even take a supplement of B6. My doctor recommended that I stop any supplements. Why would my B6 be elevated? I am having burning in my back and weakness in my legs. My doc is aware but she just says it’s unexplained pain. I’m not accepting that for an answer. Any advice?
ALP status should be checked. Borderline or low normal ALP (since it is tissue nonspecific) may be an indication that bone-specific ALP is low, in which case bone-specific ALP may be low and while vit B6 is normal or elevated, a mild form of hypophosphatasia could be present. In this case supplementation may toxic as it cannot be converted efficiently which may be why some individuals become symptomatic with low doses.
Anon
Can you kindly share a source for this? thanks
I seem to get nausea when I take B6. I was taking the coenzymated lozenge from Source Naturals. I believe it is 15mg/25p5p
It helped to take before bed but after many nights I became nauseous during the day again and my anxiety seemed to increase as well. I also take liquid zinc at night. Currently taking 4 droppers of Pure Encapsulations. During the day I take Source Naturals GABA lozenge 125mg a few times when needed. All of those help my anxiety. I eat pretty darn well 85% of the time. Lots of vegi’s.
I feel like I would feel better on B6 but I cannot understand why it makes me nauseous. Thank you for any feedback. Merry Christmas and happy holidays 2020
First of all, have you had your B6 blood level checked to see if you are B6 toxic?
B6 is in almost every food source, so you may not need to add any by supplementing with it.
Not knowing why you are taking B6 it……was it prescribed?
Two years ago, I began taking 100 mg of b complex over the counter for fatigue. Within a few months, I began having tingling, weakness and pain in my hands, feet and upper arms. Because I do have arthritis, I never connected the tingling with b6 but thought possibly spine degeneration since it was both sides of my body. It continued to get worse and I visited an orthopedic doctor. He performed a nerve conduction test and told me I had cubital tunnel syndrome. He planned to do surgery on one arm and then on the next. Since the recovery time for that surgery is months, I began to have second thoughts and postponed it. Within a few more months, I had burning pain in my shoulders and arms. Both arms and hands became so weak and the pain so severe I could no longer tie my shoes, put on a shirt or lift my arms above my shoulders. The orthopedic doctor then began searching for an issue with my spine. I received two epidurals and cortisone shots in my neck over the next few months. Neither procedure helped at all. I was then sent to a neuro surgeon who performed carpal tunnel surgery. That also did not help at all. I was sent back to the orthopedic doctor who then diagnosed me with frozen shoulder in both shoulders. No therapy helped at all. After many months of MRIs, CT’s, therapy, doctor visits, medications such as prednisone, I was only getting worse.
Doctors I visited included orthopedic, neurosurgeon, rheumatologist, and chiropractor. Finally, my orthopedic doctor , sent me to a neurologist assuming a possible muscle disease. After a nerve test there, it was determined they needed to do a muscle biopsy. I was then sent to a large hospital where they specialize in this procedure. On my first visit there, the doctor thought my symptoms did not point to a muscle disease, and wanted to do a blood panel and another nerve conduction test before the biopsy.
Two days later, they called to tell me that my b6 levels were 164 – that I had b6 toxicity and needed to detox immediately. It has now been about 6 weeks and the tingling has almost stopped, the pain and weakness has gone away. I can lift my arms over my head and was able to do push-ups for the first time last week.
I should also say that I took b6, drank protein shakes and protein bars, which also have b6, daily. I have since stopped drinking and eating those.
It was the perfect storm and not one doctor tested my b6 levels until the second neurologist before a muscle biopsy. So much pain, time and money (a lot of money) could’ve been avoided with one simple blood test.
Anonymous,
Your experiences and challenges of b6 toxicity are being diagnosed, sadly only after many trials, specialists, and failed treatments. Thankfully, neurologists are the first in line to suggest blood panels to test b6 levels.
Your story is like so many others, and I’m happy that you have reversed some of your symptoms. Just be aware, as you have experienced, the effects of the toxicity take time to go away. It has taken me 4 years to be relieved of most issues caused by the toxicity. Peripheral neuropathy ceased within 6 months, but I have struggled with burning mouth syndrome…..an incredibly debilitating condition caused by nerve damage from the excessive b6. Now, after 4+ years, the intensity has decreased.
After hearing of your challenges, and being aware that b6 toxicity is such an elusive diagnosis, I pray that more information will surface about the suffering it causes. Since most GPs and some specialists are unaware of its existence, I continue to spread the word.
Best, and continued recovery.
Janice, I have been wondering about a symptom I have that is really odd. When I was ‘toxic’ (my levels were around 450), I had really burny/itchy skin and muscle twitching. I am not longer toxic and B6 levels are normal. However, it seems I have some reaction either to stress or something I’m eating (I suspect an interaction with sugar substitutes or fillers in some supplements). Does this make any sense to you? Or am I just having lingering effects which come and go?
So sorry anonymous! I didn’t have the same severity of symptoms although my went on for a LONG time with numerous visits to doctors. I was training for a Spartan race and they kept telling me to take more vitamin B supplement, magnesium/potassium. What a crazy thing. Like you said…ONE SIMPLE BLOOD TEST…. 🙁 But at least you KNOW now are are better!
Yes I am thankful I know and that the problem was B6 instead of a muscle disease. I did notice today, like Janice said in her reply to me, that symptoms may go on for a while. After lifting something heavy today, I had pain and tingling in my arms. It went away quickly though.
Please join our group on Facebook: Understanding B6 Toxicity with Western Research to learn more, avoid misinformation, and to finally heal.
There is an absurd amount of misinformation out there, even from the most well-meaning providers. It is simply that no one has compiled ALL of the existing data on B6 in one place, analyzed it, and applied it to human healing as we have. The author of this article is invited into the group as well. Some of the information in this article needs to be corrected. For instance, we have seen B6 Toxicity arise from high B6 diets alone.
There is no magic pill for healing. One common sense formula alone works, and it is a long road taking between 1-2 years of lifestyle changes including tracking your B6 intake and never exceeding RDA. Our group prescribes a specific hydration protocol and offers support during the temporary (can be severe and last several months) worsening of symptoms that is common when you have finally removed excess toxin.
I left this particular group because I became very concerned about the “prescription” that was being pushed based on no data.
I am fine with something being shared as “this appeared to help me”. I am not comfortable with the cult-like feel of this particular group. There are other Facebook support groups that do not require adherence to an unproven and possibly harmful “protocol”.
Hi ConcernedHuman,
Can you suggest some other groups to join as well? I was found to be toxic over a year ago (I was 450+). I saw major improvements just by eliminating the B6 in my supplements. I still have days, however, when I have tingly/itchy skin and I can’t figure out if there is a trigger or if it just happens and will eventually go away or not? I would love to find as much info as I can!
Someone asked a question about other groups (but I can’t find the posting) — so I’ll update my own response here. I have found the Facebook group entitled “Exploring B6 Toxicity” to be a useful site — good for some helpful information and general support (without prescriptions).
This is just a thought. What if, women who are pregnant, or are planning to get pregnant are somewhat toxic with B6?
What would that do to a baby? Also what if babies are getting b6 toxic from all their little fortified cereal foods? There is a limit for adults, there certainly is a limit for children. I don’t know what levels of fortification are allowed in kid’s
food. If too much hurts an adult’s nerves, what could it do to a developing brain in the uterus or out side of it? Maybe everyone should get a blood panel for vitamins and minerals before pregnancy. At least if they see a toxicity, something can be done.
Thinking about everyone overloading on cadmium filled dark chocolate is scary too. Since when did the average person get that much chocolate? There are serious concerns about eating a food naturally high in cadmium. The plant sucks it right up. Some plantsare high in nickel, and so can some cookware. If you have a nickel allergy and lots of GI upset. Look to the food you love that are high in nickel. Crafted beer can be high in nickel too.
I eat animal products, organic vegetables when I can, and grains I can tolerate. Sometimes I take a mineral supplement. Sometimes I use Trudy’s great amino acid suggestions.
Thanks Trudy.
Blessings to all,
Jo
Hello,
I found your site after having painful stings throughout my body for 8 months now and went to 11 doctors. They haven’t found anything so they are ascribing my pins and needles to psychological factors. But in reality, I bet it’s B6 overdose. I took multivitamins for quite a long time, with B6, and even took a doctor prescribed multivitamin with 200 mg B6 per day called “Neuromultivit”. After taking that for a week or so I started having these symptoms.
And it went bad – the pins and needles are all over the body, not just in hands or feet. Even in my face or my eyelids. They get worse at night or after physical effort (if I do strength work in the gym, for example). It’s really scary but I hope it’s from the B6 and I hope this is reversible. I stopped any kind of vitamins since 1.5 weeks ago and hopefully I will see some improvements. I just wanted to say this so that other people seeing this don’t believe the “you’re just crazy” narrative that incompetent doctors throw upon you just because they can’t explain what’s happening (and they don’t even ask you a simple question such as “are you taking any vitamin supplements or have you taken any?”).
RAPTOR!!!!
Get a blood test and STOP ALL SUPPLEMENTS. You have the EXACT symptoms that I had, including the ‘worse after exercise’ and late at night. My level was 450 and it’s supposed to be like 20! I found out from a neurologist who gave me a 10 minute exam and told me ‘you don’t have MS or ALS -I bet you have B6 toxicity’. WHICH I DID. It took a few weeks for the symptoms to go away (I had to watch what I ate…so try to avoid foods high in B6 for a bit). It’s been a little over a year. I have the symptoms periodically, but with less frequency now.
B6 is hidden in a LOT of supplements and energy foods (protein bars, etc), so READ LABELS. Mine was from b supplements, ‘Stress Assist’ supplements and even multivitamins. My doctors told me you can’t overdose on B vitamins and that isn’t true for some of us…especially B6.
I had to stay away from spinach, eggs, etc as they are high in B6 for about a month to help the symptoms. I also found the Alphalipoic Acid (OTC) can help repair the nerve damage a bit.
Thanks. This thing is scary as it’s stinging me all over the body, not just arms and legs and it’s painful. I read that about 90% of B6 is stored in the muscles so maybe that’s why it gets worse after physical activity? Who knows?
OH, one more thing: I took 3 pills of 200mg B6 per day, one after each meal. That’s 600mg per day, not 200 as I originally thought. So basically that’s 300 times the recommended dose per day. Crazy that this thing was doctor prescribed and not even for a good reason – she threw it in there as an afterthought.
How are you doing Raptor? I think I have B6T. My main symptoms were itching and pinprick sensations. All over, as you say – eyelids. Nostrils. Ears. Feet. A strange mental anxiety feeling too.
I’m really surpised to find how many people are having issues with B6 toxicity. I have been fighting health issues from the last 6 years, diagnosed with ME, Chronic Lyme, MCAS…after a heavy pain crisis (neuropathy all over my body and head) I had a blood test and my B6 levels where high (around 88 ug/l), I haven’t been tested before for B6 Vit so I have no idea if this is behind some of the “lyme pains” I have been fighting for years. I have barely had some vit B supplementation here and there, but I always stopped it cause it made me worse. I never took anything above the reccomended levels, so it suprised me reaching toxicity levels in blood. I also get really sick when I have milk thiste (again this kind of neuropathy pains and needles everywhere), there was something written about this in the article but I just can’t understand the relationship between high B6 and high oxalate food, they are supposed to work well together right? I mean, if your B6 levels are high you should get rid very well of oxalate…so I think there is something missing. The symptoms got better after leaving the multivitamin but they come back again and again and it has been happening for years so, could be a dietary thing or something else.
Just to bring it to the discussion, cause it may be interesting for future research, I have DAO deficiency (enzyme degradating histamine) and high glucoronidase levels with high bilirrubin blood levels (Gilbert’s syndrome) so I detox very bad and I’m apparently sensitive to toxics and high histamine food. I believe most people with B6 toxicity levels and vitamin sensitivity could have detox or adquired genetic problems. It’s we people and patients who needs to research and fight to know more about this conditions, doctors may tell you that its all in your head but everything has a reason and one nows when something is going wrong in his own body.
Thanks for sharing the info!!
Hi there. I have also lyme disease and 2013 I was diagnosted with pyroluria. Since then I take b6 and it is getting worse since last year I had a relapse with lyme disease. But I wonder maybe I have b6 toxicity.
What were/are your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues?
*I had symptoms 2 months after I stopped taking B6.. extreme nerve pain, vertigo, swelling in brain*
Have you resolved the symptoms and if yes how? *Somewhat.. first relief I have had is from an anti inflammatory diet and going Gluten Free*
Did you make any other changes around the same time i.e. stopping and/or other nutritional support? *Anti Inflammatory Liquid herb tincture and Olive Leaf Oil Tincture*
Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking? *Roughly 100 mg a day while pregnant.. Diclegis pharmaceutical name – for extreme nausea*
And how much did you take and how often? *100 mg a day for 9 months while pregnant*
If you have pyroluria were you also taking zinc and how much? (Dr. Pfeiffer recommended taking zinc together with vitamin B6). *Not relevant to me*
Past history or current use of medications like benzodiazepines (such as Ativan, Xanax, valium etc.), gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP / birth control pill, SSRIs /antidepressants (such as Prozac, Celexa, Lexapro, Paxil, Zoloft etc.), fluroquinolone antibiotics (such as ciprofloxacin/Cipro, gemifloxacin/Factive, levofloxacin/Levaquin, moxifloxacin/Avelox, norfloxacin/Noroxin and ofloxacin/Floxin), PPIs (proton pump inhibitors such as Nexium for heart-burn), diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc.? *Used to take Xanax but not while pregnant / when I was taking the B6*
What kind of EMF exposure do you have – WiFi in the home and/or at work, how much cell phone use in a day, cordless phones at home and/or work and a smart meter at home? *Wifi.. phone use..*
What kind of exposure have you had to GMOs and pesticides (i.e. do you only eat organic food), glyphosate (eg. Roundup exposure from lawns, golf courses, parks etc.), plastics/phthalates (do you avoid plastics)? * I have been eating all organic for roughly 15 years now*
What polymorphisms do you have: cytochrome P450 polymorphisms (we know some of these make benzodiazepines more toxic and more difficult to taper in about 60% of those prescribed these meds), and/or MTHFR polymorphism (may affect our detox ability if it’s expressing) and others you know about? *no*
Did you take a B complex (or a multivitamin that contains all the B vitamins) with the vitamin B6? *multivitamin and High dose of B6 while pregnant*
Did you also take magnesium with the vitamin B6 and if yes how much? (Bernie Rimland reported that taking vitamin B6 together with magnesium resulted in an improved behavior of ASD (autism spectrum patients)) *No*
Have you observed any correlation with intake of dietary oxalates i.e. worsening symptoms when consuming medium or high oxalate foods (such as spinach, kale, berries, nuts, kiwi fruit, eggplant etc.) or using vitamin C or milk thistle, and less severe symptoms when consuming a low oxalate diet? (Susan Owens is founder of http://www.lowoxalate.info and shares that vitamin B6 is the most efficacious vitamin for reducing oxalates and that we also don’t know if *Gluten makes my neuropathy worse.. so does starchy items, Potatoes etc*
Do you have a thyroid disease? “peripheral diseases frequently include polyneuropathy” *no*
Have you been diagnosed with an autoimmune condition and if yes, which one?t for improving the symptoms of pyroluria/social anxiety, reducing inflammation and oxidative stress, easing PMS and hormonal issues and much more. I share links to the research on the many benefits of supplemental vitamin B6 in this blog: Vitamin B6 improves dream recall (which can be used to monitor vitamin B6 status). *no*
hello what do you think about the life extension mix multivitamin? i just bought it but I saw it have tremendous amounts of b6! should i take it or not?
NOOOOO… If you have been B6 toxic don’t take ANY B6. It is hidden in so many things…read all labels (protein bars, drinks, energy drinks, etc).
If there are now tests specifically for people that have toxic levels of B6, I wouldn’t take anything with whopping doses of that.
Best to you,
Jo
Thomas,
Please check with your doctor. But, if you have experienced B6 toxicity, and it has pyridoxine hydrocloride as the form of b6, I would say that’s a big NO!!!!!!
I have pyroluria. I take supplements since 2013 because of pyroluria. Now i think I’m toxicity, because I have so many symptoms.
Are there are withdrawal symptoms when you stop taking b6?
The rare Genetic disorder called Hypophosphatasia cannot handle levels of B6 very well. We naturally have high levels, so any additional added through our foods, makes us not feel well.
Hi
I’ve been on tresos B pluse for over 10 years. I originally started it when I began a uni degree to help with stress, anxiety and memory function. About 6 months ago I started having half the tablet due to the cost. The tablet has a score in it so I thought it would be fine to snap in half. A couple of weeks later I started getting bilateral burning, tingling and aching feet. Kind of felt like I had a tight glove on both my feet at times.
I have had numerous tests and the latest is that a neurologist has diagnosed me with small fibre neuropathy.
After reading the above, I’m wondering if it would be possible that the tresos b pluse vitamin I’ve been halving lately could be creating some sort of toxicity with my nerves? A friend told me recently that when you half a multivitamin the dose can be more potent.
Could you shed some light on this or any other input please?
Hi Trudy,
I got tested for B6 and my level was super toxic – normal ranges was quoted as 80-140 and my level is 7901 (almost 8 thousand).
The bloods ordered by a neurologist with very wide coverage.
What were/are your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues?
My symptoms started about 5 weeks ago with some numbness and heat/cold in left foot and hand, this developed to both sides and moved up leg and arm – classic glove stocking presentation, a bof limping too. This further developed into, tremors, acid burn under skin in various places around the body, difficulty focusing, anxiety and more numbness and burning.
The above came in episodes – sometimes 1-2 hours, sometimes 5-7 hours.
Sleeping required a sitting up position with my legs elevated on large pillows, this all developed over the course of 3 weeks.
Have you resolved the symptoms and if yes how?
They have lessened since I have been following the Wahls protocol/Diet.
All wild parasthesia has gone with the exception that my left foot and leg and left hand; tremors still there but much less, minor disorientation episodes, but lessening.
Did you make any other changes around the same time i.e. stopping and/or other nutritional support?
Yes, Wahls proctol, I started this based on the belief that I had something significant wrong with my nervous system and assumed it could be MS, so followed that.
Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking?
I only only ever too a B complex and sometime B1 supplements. If this is not genetic or from some other cause, then I would say I fall into the category described by some of the academics as interindividual, with a low dose tolerance I guess.
And how much did you take and how often?
One B complex tablet a day on and off for some years, but with often big gaps of no vitamins. (i don’t know the brand). Although I was on a sailing tripe a month before this, where I took a Berocca style B-complex fizzy tablet 1- 3. day, the name of this product was Voost – I checked the levels of B6 in this, quite low.
If you have pyroluria were you also taking zinc and how much? (Dr. Pfeiffer recommended taking zinc together with vitamin B6).
N/A
Past history or current use of medications like benzodiazepines (such as Ativan, Xanax, valium etc.), gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP / birth control pill, SSRIs /antidepressants (such as Prozac, Celexa, Lexapro, Paxil, Zoloft etc.), fluroquinolone antibiotics (such as ciprofloxacin/Cipro, gemifloxacin/Factive, levofloxacin/Levaquin, moxifloxacin/Avelox, norfloxacin/Noroxin and ofloxacin/Floxin), PPIs (proton pump inhibitors such as Nexium for heart-burn), diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc.?
No medications
However, on the boat trip (one month at sea, just myself and my uncle on a bad diet I would have to say, too many carbs) I drank water form the water tank which was infected with adhesive from my uncle trying to fix a leak in the tank, I drank this water for two weeks so this could be related as I know chemically induced Neuropathy can take weeks to present. At the same time my B6 is sky high so I am not sure if there is a connection between that and possible Hexanedione toxicity.
What kind of EMF exposure do you have – WiFi in the home and/or at work, how much cell phone use in a day, cordless phones at home and/or work and a smart meter at home?
Phone all day, no wifi.
What kind of exposure have you had to GMOs and pesticides (i.e. do you only eat organic food), glyphosate (eg. Roundup exposure from lawns, golf courses, parks etc.), plastics/phthalates (do you avoid plastics)?
I only eat about 5-10% organic.
Maybe the adhesive in the water tank on my uncles boat released plastic as it was a very strong glue.
What polymorphisms do you have: cytochrome P450 polymorphisms (we know some of these make benzodiazepines more toxic and more difficult to taper in about 60% of those prescribed these meds), and/or MTHFR polymorphism (may affect our detox ability if it’s expressing) and others you know about?
Unknown.
Did you take a B complex (or a multivitamin that contains all the B vitamins) with the vitamin B6?
Did you also take magnesium with the vitamin B6 and if yes how much? (Bernie Rimland reported that taking vitamin B6 together with magnesium resulted in an improved behavior of ASD (autism spectrum patients))
as above.
Have you observed any correlation with intake of dietary oxalates i.e. worsening symptoms when consuming medium or high oxalate foods (such as spinach, kale, berries, nuts, kiwi fruit, eggplant etc.) or using vitamin C or milk thistle, and less severe symptoms when consuming a low oxalate diet? (Susan Owens is founder of http://www.lowoxalate.info and shares that vitamin B6 is the most efficacious vitamin for reducing oxalates and that we also don’t know if the classic signs of vitamin B6 toxicity has anything to do with oxalate dumping symptoms.)
None of the above items seem to have exacerbated this, however I notice spinach might have triggered something but not kale.
Do you have a thyroid disease? “peripheral diseases frequently include polyneuropathy”
NO
Have you been diagnosed with an autoimmune condition and if yes, which one?
Psoriasis, I am also ANA positive (80) but ENA negative so there may be something to explore there.
Is there anything else that you have discovered that you suspect may be a factor?
Of note in this context:
In my bloods:
Zinc was low (borderline)
B1 was high (300 vs normal suggested maximum of 200)
B6 was insanely high at 7901 a I said
B12 at low end of normal range
Mercury was 67 (moderately high and above normal)
Billirubin high >33 ( it always is as I have Gilberts)
I’ve done a lot of research so far, lots of academic studies out there and thankfully I don’t take any single one as sooth as the conclusions are often replaced by newer studies refuting certain statements.
Hypophosphatasia is a genetic cause of high B6 and can present as late adult onset wthout the horrible symptoms of the childhood version, I plan to get checked for that.
My Mercury is high – chelation therapy might help just to be sure., I eat a reasonable amount of fish so that could be the cause there.
MRI results come in this week.
The onset is date coincident with the boat trip by several weeks so i suspect there could be chemical induction involved here, yet I cant connect the sky high B6 with that.
I have documented need for more B6 through organic acids testing. My blood level only 5, I think. I tried P5P but it made me so anxious and crazy. That was a 50mg dose. I tried a 20mg does – same thing. I now just use inactive B6 and don’t have an issue. I don’t understand why the active form causes such anxiety if I have a need for more. The anxiety only resolved a few days after stopping B6.
Thanks for the article Trudy.
You mention that “In the USA, per this article on the NIH site, the upper limit is set at 100mg/day.”
This is correct, but do you mention anywhere that NIH’s recommended doses are 1/50th of this, less than 2mg/day? https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/VitaminB6-HealthProfessional/#:~:text=Table%201%3A%20Recommended,1.5%20mg
I have toxic levels of B6 but I have NO adverse affects that I have noticed. I thought my information is still relevant for your research. My doctor said I have 20 times higher than the safe limit in my blood.
What were/are your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues?
I noticed that the improvements I had when I started taking the B6 began to reverse. I noticed this over the past 6 months, 18 months after I began taking the supplement. But have none of the symptoms of B6 toxicity such a numbness or tingling, etc (yet…?)
Have you resolved the symptoms and if yes how?
Not yet but I only found out only yesterday that I have toxic level of B6 after a blood test
Did you make any other changes around the same time i.e. stopping and/or other nutritional support?
No I will just stop taking the b6 and see how I go
Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking?
Both
And how much did you take and how often?
400mg B6 daily
and
100mg P5P daily
for 2 years
If you have pyroluria were you also taking zinc and how much? (Dr. Pfeiffer recommended taking zinc together with vitamin B6).
Yes I have mild pyroluria so I started take 150-300mg of zinc daily 2 years ago. My zinc levels are now normal.
Past history or current use of medications like benzodiazepines (such as Ativan, Xanax, valium etc.), gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP / birth control pill, SSRIs /antidepressants (such as Prozac, Celexa, Lexapro, Paxil, Zoloft etc.), fluroquinolone antibiotics (such as ciprofloxacin/Cipro, gemifloxacin/Factive, levofloxacin/Levaquin, moxifloxacin/Avelox, norfloxacin/Noroxin and ofloxacin/Floxin), PPIs (proton pump inhibitors such as Nexium for heart-burn), diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc.?
None of the above
What kind of EMF exposure do you have – WiFi in the home and/or at work, how much cell phone use in a day, cordless phones at home and/or work and a smart meter at home?
Pretty much constantly. Wifi at home and work, lots of cell phone use.
What kind of exposure have you had to GMOs and pesticides (i.e. do you only eat organic food), glyphosate (eg. Roundup exposure from lawns, golf courses, parks etc.), plastics/phthalates (do you avoid plastics)?
I live in australia so I believe our GMOs and pesticide levels are lower than in the USA. I do not buy organic.
What polymorphisms do you have: cytochrome P450 polymorphisms (we know some of these make benzodiazepines more toxic and more difficult to taper in about 60% of those prescribed these meds), and/or MTHFR polymorphism (may affect our detox ability if it’s expressing) and others you know about?
N/a
Did you take a B complex (or a multivitamin that contains all the B vitamins) with the vitamin B6?
No
Did you also take magnesium with the vitamin B6 and if yes how much? (Bernie Rimland reported that taking vitamin B6 together with magnesium resulted in an improved behavior of ASD (autism spectrum patients))
Yes – 800mg magenisum Glycinate and 280mg magnesium oxide daily
Have you observed any correlation with intake of dietary oxalates i.e. worsening symptoms when consuming medium or high oxalate foods (such as spinach, kale, berries, nuts, kiwi fruit, eggplant etc.) or using vitamin C or milk thistle, and less severe symptoms when consuming a low oxalate diet? (Susan Owens is founder of http://www.lowoxalate.info and shares that vitamin B6 is the most efficacious vitamin for reducing oxalates and that we also don’t know if the classic signs of vitamin B6 toxicity has anything to do with oxalate dumping symptoms.)
No
Do you have a thyroid disease? “peripheral diseases frequently include polyneuropathy”
No
Have you been diagnosed with an autoimmune condition and if yes, which one?
No
Is there anything else that you have discovered that you suspect may be a factor?
Simone
Thanks for sharing that you have high B6 levels and no toxicity symptoms. It’s very relevant to learning more.
Can you share what symptoms reversed when you started the B6 – pyroluria symptoms? and which symptoms?
Hi there! I know I am writing in a couple years late, lol, but I just wanted to share my own experience using B6 (P-5-P form). In even a very small amount (1.5mg every other day), it makes me very full of angst and tired. I have tried a few different supplements that include b6 and notice within a few days that I feel agitated and exhausted. For some reason, B12 alone seems like the best fit for me. I have read that people with a COM-T gene mutation can react poorly to B vitams. I have not had this test done, but COMT is very common, and I think this might be me.
Hope this helps!
My labs show 26.6 ng/ml, which the lab had marked as extremely high [the listed maximum “normal” B6 was 21.7 ng/ml], even though I have not taken supplemental B6 for the past six months at least. I experience internal tremors/vibrations and I also had balance problems until I stopped taking B6 supplements at 50 mg. How long will it take for the B6 to flush out of my system? It has already been six months and I only took these vitamins for about four months in total.
Your questions:
– no SSRIs
– no info on polymorphisms.
– yes to magnesium
– unaware of pyroluria and/or have no diagnosis of it
Hi,
My Vit B 6 level is in the 300s. I was advised to discontinue my Multivitamin (which contains 25mg B6). Do you know of a Multivitamin I can take that does not have B6 or has low levels? I don’t want to stop taking vitamins and become deficient in anything.
Thanks
I am in the same boat! By chance are you taking a Metagenics Brand?
Hi, I’d like to share my story for awareness. I started taking a B-complex supplement in hopes of increasing my energy. The suggested dosage was 2 capsules that contained a total of 10mg of B6. I took this for around 8months and some days I would only take 1 capsule (containing 5mgs of B6). Last month, I started experiencing severe burning and itching sensations in my feet and then in my fingers, which usually started in the afternoons and evenings. My feet and hands would turn red, itchy and painful. I also experienced tingling and occasional numbness in my left upper arm and general weakness in my left arm and trouble coordinating movement in my left hand. At night my arms would fall asleep and I felt pins and needles. I was so frightened and thought it was MS.
I went to see a neurologist and they had my iron and B6 levels checked. My iron was low and my B6 was at 65 ng/ml which is 3.5 times more than the maximum normal range! (Normal B6 ranges are around 2.1-21.7ng/ml). My neurologist asked me to stop taking vitamin B supplements. I have been off of it for a 10days now and the burning and itching is almost gone. The numbness at night is a lot better too. Without a doubt my symptoms were related to the accumulation of B6 in my body. I believe that B6 toxicity can happen at lower dosages like 10mg or even 5mg when taken for a period of 6months everyday like in my case. B6 does have a half-life of 25-33 days and can accumulate in the plasma and muscle tissues leading to toxicity. Hope this helps someone in a similar situation!
I am a 45 year old female, status post Roux En Y, gastric bypass patient (1.5 years post bypass) who is experiencing extremely high B-1 and B-6 levels, despite being on only a 25mg B-6 regimented multivitamin dose/ daily.
All other vitamins levels are within normal / appropriate range. I do know that I have the MTHFR genetic defect and must have all B vitamins methylated. Which they are.
Can anyone suggest why I am at extremely high levels, despite lack of overdosing on the supplements?
B-6 level of 208.8 (normal range of 20-125)
B1 level of 210 (normal range of 70-180)
Hi Amy,
2mgs of B6 daily provides 100% of the daily value so anything above 2mg taken over a long period of time builds up in the body. At least that is what happened in my case.
I took 2-4 multi-vitamins a day for a year and gradually got worse and worse with regards to balance and my strength in my hands and legs. I eventually was hospitalized and diagnosed with vitamin b6 toxicity. My level was like 250 micro grams when 5-50 was normal.
6 months later, I am still not walking. In the last week, my muscles and legs and arms are tingling more and more where I almost cannot move certain body parts. I only hope that this is my nerves regrowing. I haven’t worried about foods containing b6 either like cereal. I just wonder if part of the recovery process from the neuropathy involves getting worse to get better?
1.This is the most fascinating source I have found yet that is related to all my issues. I have have GERD related issues for several years now, but for the past couple of years I started experiencing difficulty burping, which I thought was due to GERD (and that could still be). I realized this happens more when I eat specific vegetables like spinach, brocoly, etc, so I started avoiding them. Otherwise I would wake up at night bloated and unable to burp or pass gas. However about a year ago I slowly weaned myself off Mirtazapine, Pantoprazole and right after I had a stressful event in my life. I also stopped exercising so much right around the same time (pandemic hit). Before I was exercising a LOT and sweating 3 times a week (which could have been how B6 and mercury got washed out from the body). Right around the same time I took a string antibiotic and developed bursitis and strange muscle tremors all over the body. As I was also heavily sleep deprived because of nightly stomach inflammation and inability to burp or pass gas at night. The bursitis took several month to heal but my condition deteriorated and I was experiencing lots of muscle twitching and some tingling in my left toe as well as cold hands. Then I discovered I had blastocystis and hpilory and worked hard to eradicate those, also was put on a strict leaky gut diet. It helped a little with my stomach. I discovered that I have high mercury toxicity and was told to remove all my 5 amalgam fillings and a failed root canal, which I completed just 4 months ago. More recently (3 months ago) I discovered that I have high B6 toxicity, likely from taking GNC Mega Men Sport multivitamins which I took for over 20 years. I stopped those and my muscle twitches and even stomach issues slightly became better, but they are not going away completely and comeback when I eat foods that are either high in B6 (salmon, banana, avocado, etc) or not good for my sensitive stomach (soy, garlic, spices, too salty or pretty much anything sweet, gassy stuff like ligaments), etc.
2. The issues have subsided, but are not resolved completely. Anytime I eat anything with high B6 the issues become more pronounced.
3. Stopped taking Multi Vitamins that had 50mg of synthetic B6, B12, B2, etc.
4. Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking?
5. I only took 1 pill of Meta Man Sport by GNC which was 50mg of synthetic B6, B12, B2 and Zinc 25mg and lots of other stuff
6. Zinc 25mg.
7. Pantoprazole, Mirtazapine, some other PPIs and baclofen.
8. WIFI, cell phone
9. Nothing unusual, occasionally drinking from plastic bottles, good water filter a home.
10. not sure
11. Multi Vitamins that had 50mg of synthetic B6, B12, B2, etc.
12. Magnesium 50mg
13. Over the past several years, I had started experiencing sensitivities to various vegetables, anything gassy like brocoly and anything leafy like spinach, etc. It would give me micro burps which were no big deal during the day, but at night I would get gas trapped in my stomach and I was not able to burp or pass gas which made me miserable. This became much worse about a year ago.
14. No thyroid disease, but T4 was a little elevated.
15. No
I was taking dessicated liver tablets uni liver and I developed tingling in my left hand and head and electrical zaps in my body. Was diagnosed with tangentiality.
First time in 57 years I get 1 tablet of 200 mg b6 and my bpm went from 80 to 174 .I am using health monitor for months and I can pinpoint in minutes when that happened discovering the culprit b6.I was not active at the time at all.Tahicardia should be included in warning of this vitamin.
Hi Trudy – I started taking 50 mg p5p when I started detoxing copper on my own. I didn’t seem to have any problems with it. But then I started working with a nutritionist specializing in pyroluria and nutrient deficiencies. My whole family (husband, 4 kids) all have pyroluria except me. I have Hashimotos and (probably) nearly lifelong low zinc and high copper. I am 51 now. The nutritionist (who I don’t think was wrong) had me go on 100 mg p5p and 100 mg B6. I loved the way it helped my mood. I upped the p5p to 200 mg, like my pyroluria family was taking. This was a mistake. I started waking up with pain in the joints of my hands. I ignored it for a while. The pain was only in the morning for about an hour. But after several months of this, I started to get worried. I initially dropped the B6, and just took the 200 mg p5p. Then I gradually lowered that dose to 100. Then to 50. Then to nothing. By then I was having muscle cramps in my legs as well and feeling the hand pain during the day, too. I gave it all up 2 weeks ago and had a week pain free. But this week, my left hand is hurting again even though I’m not taking any B6 or p5p. I imagine it will take a while to get rid of the neuropathy.
Interestingly, I suggested my mom take it too. She’s been taking 50 mg p5p and 100 mg B6. She has a great deal of social anxiety and I thought it would help her. We spoke 2 days ago and she complained of neuropathy and muscle cramps. I told her to go off all of it.
Maybe this is a hereditary thing. No one else in my family (husband and kids with pyroluria have this problem and they are all taking 200 mg p5p and 200 mg b6. No neuropathy!
Anyway, I do have a history of taking SSRIs, but have been off for years. I do take vitamin C – 2,000 mg a day. I take all the other B vitamins. I take zinc and mag taurate, ProOmega fish oil, gaba (recently dropped that as well, but took it daily for a few years), folinic acid, and adeno b12.
I’m struggling being off B6 because it really helped my mood a lot. My zinc is finally back up, but I feel like I need that B6. I won’t take it again, though. I can’t live with the neuropathy.
Hope you find some answers for us B6 intolerant people! I’ll keep looking as well. Thanks for all you do. I learned about pyroluria from you and it has greatly helped my family. I also learned about the B6 toxicity (or intolerance) here as well. I really appreciate all the research you’ve done and knowledge that you share!
Hi, my name is Chiara, I have CFS, SIBO, thyroiditis, neurobegetative dystonia since 2013, I am now 28 years old.
My life is very limited, I can’t study, get a job or even go out with my friends to have fun.
I tried high dosages of B1 for a year and I must say that my gastroparesis cured, they made me return to normal thermoregulation (before I had constantly frozen hands and feet and I felt paralyzed by the cold), however it did not solve my problems of physical and mental fatigue nor my nervous attacks in which I feel like crying I have pangs of hunger and I seem to lose control.
I have been integrating B6 for a week because I know that it is important for the production of dopamine and for the enzymes involved in the degradation of oxalates. However, something strange happens when I take P5P: for two hours I have very strong nausea, I have to stay in bed with my eyes closed and I can not do anything, then the nausea passes and all the benefits (more energy, mental clarity and desire to do things) occur as an effect of the vitamin. I take a dose of 100mg, I tried with 50, the neusea almost not comare but also the benefits are very small.
I was wondering if you have an explanation for this and if by chance it could be a sign of B6 toxicity (although I thought you presented with numbness and tingling).
Thanks for all you do and for the information you give in this blog, your work is precless. I will study your gaba probram too
Chiara
I’ve had tingling from my waist down for decades along with a sensation of coldness. I have never knowingly/deliberately taken any B6 supplementation. When I took multivitamins years ago they were specifically without B. I’ve been to numerous Drs and never gotten a satisfactory diagnosis. I just got results back from my latest blood work and my B6 is 76mg. I believe this is the first time that my B6 has ever been tested. I am 76. They asked me if I was on any vitamins or any energy drinks and I am not on anything that would normally unknowingly increase B6 level. I was attempting to research why else my B6 could be high and came across your website. I have taken many meds on your list. In the past but not currently: Statins and PPIs. For many years and currently: benzodiazepines, Wellbutrin, metoprolol, Lasix.
EMF exposure is fairly standard house full of electronics, daily cell phone use, computers etc. for decades now I have been aware that I am sensitive to EMFs. When I am having a “flare up” it makes my lower half tingling and coldness worse, nearly unbearable. I have purchased EMF blockers and similar products for my house and car that seems to help.
I’m not aware of any correlation of those symptoms with high oxalate foods.
Average exposure to the items in question 9.
10. Unknown
No B6 or multivitamin
I do take magnesium occasionally
I don’t have a thyroid condition
I have been diagnosed with the following autoimmune conditions: lymphocytic colitis, lichen sclerosis, slightly elevated scleroderma, arteriosclerosis, gastritis, hyperlipidemia
I am completely stumped as to how I would have a high B6 level without having taken supplements or energy/protein drinks or protein bars. If perhaps B6 builds up in me then it would make more sense.
I’m very curious if you have any thoughts.
Thank you,
Sherri
Hello Trudy,
I mostly follow Paul Jaminet’s Perfect Health Diet & his supplement recommendations since 2015 & had never had any of my new tingling feet/neuropathy issues until a while after switching my once week a week dose of 50-100mg of Pyridoxine HCL to the P5P “active” form 50mg once a week.
I started having tingling in my feet/neuropathy back in March. About a month ago it was worse & had progressed to my hands & some sensations throughout my body intermittently still. I researched what could have caused this new condition l, & suspected it was my once weekly dose of B6 as I had switched within the last year to 50mg of the “active” form P5P from the regular Peridoxine HCL that I had taken 50-100 mg once a week for years without issue. I discontinued it at least a month ago & haven’t taken any B6 supplements since, & I had my MD test my Plasma Vitamin B6 a week ago & it came back high. The reference range is 2.1-21.7 ng/ml & mine is 31.5 (high).
My plan is to stay off any supplemental B6 until we retest maybe in 3 months & once it’s normal, use good old regular B6 at 25-50mg once a week.
In addition to no B6 supplements, I’ve been alternating charcoal & bentonite clay & sweating some each day.
The tingling is very alarming to me & has improved some & I hope & pray that my body will fully detox & heal from this toxicity.
I would appreciate any suggestions from you or anyone else on how to detox & recover from my B6 toxicity.
I urge people to stick with low dose 50-100mg regular Pyridoxine HCL B6 once a week to prevent deficiency per Paul Jaminet. Stay away from P5P!
Sincerely,
Holly
Just a few days since I put in my two cents & negative side effects from P5P & my tingling has lessened a bit more.
To answer my own question, I received a response already from Paul that I could take B12 to mitigate my B6 toxicity, & he said going forward, there’s no reason to supplement B6 on a whole foods diet such as Perfect Health Diet, but as I said, when following Paul’s suggested 50-100mg of regular B6 (Pyridoxine HCL) once every 1-2 weeks, I did this with no issue for years. Only when I fell for the marketing hype & claims on P5P, & made the mistake of listening to people on forums without doing my own research, & switched to P5P did I start experiencing toxicity including neuropathy. Since discontinuing at least a month ago, I’m nearly all the way better & am confident I will fully recover.
There’s also some other stories similar to mine on the Ray Peat forum.
i went through this and 4 years later still have nerve damage. exercise and sweat as much as you can. i don’t detox well and it took me 18 months to normalize my b6 which was 12 times normal. sensory neuropathy is no fun, and i also have associated erythromelalgia. i take methyl bs without b6. my neuropathy is improved from 4 years ago when i experienced nightly torturous flares.
i had b6 toxicity from a dr. prescribed synthetic b complex called folbic. it was given to treat elevated homocysteine. it didn’t work so she doubled the dose. it turns out i have the compound hetero version of MTHFR which often results in elevated homocysteine because i can’t utilize synthetic b vitamins as i’m lacking an enzyme genetically. the solution would have been to use the methylated form. Over the 4 years she had me on this, i developed a terrible sensory neuropathy with related erythromelalgia (red, hot burning feet). it took me a long time to figure out why i got this. when testing my b6 levels, they were 12 times the normal level, and it took 18 months for me to bring to normal. during that time, the neuropathy got worse and full body while it worked its way out of my tissues. 4 years later, i am much better, but still have flares and sensory neuropathy. btw, i fixed my homocysteine on my own, taking methyl b and folate (not folic acid which i also can’t utilize). i wish i could fix my nerve damage.
I am 2 1/2 months pregnant and my morning sickness has been rough. My doctor suggested B6 to help. I took one 100mg pill yesterday evening with dinner, for the first time, and was hoping to wake up feeling good the next day. I was so wrong. I got into bed to sleep and tossed and turned with the worst body pains. I felt sweaty and horrible. I hardly slept at all. I felt like my body was tingling and getting hot. I could not get comfortable. Finally slept for four hours but woke up at 5am parched and dizzy. I definitely had b6 poisoning as I’ve never felt that way before- it was wretched. I immediately threw out the pills and got online to see what I could find. I see I am not alone! I am terrified that it harmed my unborn baby somehow :(. Trying to flush out my system with lots of water and healthy food. Aside from a prenatal vitamin I do not take any other medicine. I eat healthy. I am 35 and this will be my second baby. My blood type is A+, I eat lots of fruits and veggies (snacked on blueberries and watermelon) and made yummy naan flatbread for dinner with tomato sauce and mozzarella the evening I took the b6 vitamin. I don’t have any known allergies but do occasionally have low iron levels. I can’t believe this was prescribe by my doctor. I will definitely be bringing this to her attention at our next visit :,(
Hello Trudy
I can absolutely assure you that B6 in small amounts can cause B6 Toxicity.
I am one of literally hundreds of thousands of people worldwide who suffer B6 Toxicity.
Yes it is deemed ‘water soluble’ but unfortunately sits in the muscles and nerve ends.
I have been toxic since 2016 with levels at 1280 (Australian levels). I developed symptoms almost immediately, pain, PN, gut issues, visual symptoms. Nothing would relieve it. My Dr disregarded my levels.
In 2018, I was then diagnosed with a brain aneurysm with ensuing brain surgery to save my life. My B6T symptoms continued and then worsened in 2020 when I became seriously ill, struggling to eat due to gut pain, blood pooling in my legs, severe chronic and also stabbing electrical pain in legs, full body numbness, difficulty breathing, speaking, visual symptoms and so much more. I thought I was dying.
I ended up in hospital for a month and needed rehab for 3 months more.
It took another year to realise my B6 levels were still dreadfully high. I developed Orthostatic intolerance, my EDS was exacerbated, my muscles wasted and I developed osteopenia as the B6 T sapped my vitamin D.
I have recently just done an interview with ABC News.
Here it is for your viewing.
B6 Toxicity is VERY real. It is in a multitude of vitamin supplements, people are multi dosing without knowing .
Don’t give it out. It is highly dangerous even at very small levels
I add another site for your reference
Cheers
Keri McInerney
Australia
ABC NEWS B6 TOXICITY
https://amp.abc.net.au/article/101351800
B6 TOXICITY INTERNATIONAL WEBSITE
https://understandingb6toxicity.com/
Keri
Thanks for sharing this. I’m out of the country on a family trip and will dive in and watch and share my input.
I am sorry to hear what you have been through and am curious why you feel your symptoms are/were due to vitamin B6 toxicity – because of a high vitamin B6 level?
Thank you for posting your story Keri, I also saw the story on ABC and other news in Australia. I hope you are feeling better.
I have been taking a B Complex (Metabolic Maintenance brand) 5 days a week for years, so does my husband. I recently had all B’s tested and they are all in range except B6! Which is 900 nmol/L, the normal range should be 20-190 (in Australian measurements). My husband who is Type 1 diabetic has 450 nmol/L of B6 but he is huge man and very tall. I’m 164cm in height and small. I am menopausal but have no other health conditions nor medications. One year ago I noticed all my muscles aching and they ache everyday. I just thought it was menopause but now I’m starting to think it could be the B6. My husband is already at risk of peripheral neuropathy being Type 1, so we have both decided to stop taking the B Complex to flush out the B6. We will continue to take B 12 lozenges.
Even though it is water soluble, B6 is being stored longer in the body because the Half Life of B6 is up to 33 days. Supplement companies need to adjust the amount of B6 in their complex formulations. The body just doesn’t need this much.
Thank you again for your story.
Jane
Jane
Thanks for sharing. There are many factors that can cause aching muscles and I’d explore those before concluding that vitamin B6 is the issue, even with elevated test results (which may not be reflective of elevated vitamin B6 status). Some examples include gluten, dietary oxalates, statins, low GABA, low serotonin, low endorphins, low magnesium (much of which I cover on this blog – use the search feature) and in my book.
Please do keep me posted on what you discover.
Hi Trudy
It’s been 1 month since I stopped taking the B Complex containing 50mgs of B6. I can report that my muscle aching has all gone!!! It’s amazing, I wake up every morning and feel young again instead of being sore all over.
I can assure you I have been taking high quality magnesium’s for years, i am also gluten free and take GABA every night. It was without a doubt the B6 that was causing the body aching at such a deep level.
Trudy I have always respected your work and generous contribution to the field of nutrition, along with the kindness you show to your readers. However I do question why you are so defensive of B6, it’s very noticeable. You have been collecting feedback on collegen now for years and starting to write about its negative effect but you seem reluctant to the same for Vit B6. B6 is an integral part of your treatment protocols for every mental health issue and to cast doubt on it is not good for your treatment models. If Emergency wards in Australian hospitals are warning against high levels of B6 then why aren’t more nutritionists doing the same.
I now have to find a B Complex with lower levels of all B’s.
Jane
The TGA in Australia has issued a Health Warning regarding the risk of peripheral neuropathy with high intake of B6.
Here is the warning from their government website,
Vitamin B6 (pyridoxine)
Safety advisory – potential for dose-related adverse events
Published
5 May 2020
Vitamin B6, also known as pyridoxine, is commonly present in multivitamin and mineral preparations, vitamin B complexes, and in combination with magnesium.
A known side effect of vitamin B6 is peripheral neuropathy, which has symptoms of tingling, burning or numbness, usually in the hands or feet. It usually occurs at high doses or following long-term use of products containing vitamin B6. Peripheral neuropathy is not associated with normal dietary intakes of vitamin B6.
Vitamin B6 is permitted for use in listed medicines containing daily doses of up to 200 mg.
There are currently more than 1000 listed medicines in Australia that contain vitamin B6. However, due to the risk of peripheral neuropathy, products that contain more than 50 mg are required to have the following warning displayed on the product label:
‘WARNING – Stop taking this medication if you experience tingling, burning or numbness and see your healthcare practitioner as soon as possible. (Contains vitamin B6)’
Products containing 50 mg or less vitamin B6 are not currently required to display a label warning. This may make it difficult for consumers to identify reactions associated with vitamin B6, which could potentially lead to continued exposure and progression of neuropathy.
The TGA is aware of recent reports, both in Australia and overseas, which indicate that peripheral neuropathy may occur:
at a daily dose of less than 50 mg a day of vitamin B6 in consumers taking more than one product containing vitamin B6
The TGA is currently reviewing this issue and the outcome of this review may result in changes to the requirements for medicines that contain vitamin B6.
Information for consumers
You should be aware of the association between vitamin B6 and peripheral neuropathy, and that B6 may be in more than one of the products you take. Vitamin B6 might be listed on the label by one of its chemical names (pyridoxine hydrochloride, pyridoxal 5-phosphate or pyridoxal 5-phosphate monohydrate).
If you take products that contain vitamin B6, be aware of symptoms of peripheral neuropathy, such as tingling, burning, or numbness. If you experience any of these symptoms, you should stop taking the product and seek medical advice.
You should discuss any concerns or questions you have about this issue with your health professional.
Information for health professionals
You should be aware that peripheral neuropathy can occur at doses of less than 50 mg of vitamin B6 a day. Additionally, patients presenting with symptoms of peripheral neuropathy should be reviewed for vitamin B6 intake from sources such as B vitamins, multivitamins and/or magnesium products, particularly if taken in combination. When treating patients for peripheral neuropathy, you should consider whether a complementary medicine or dietary supplement could be involved.
Further information about the risks of vitamin B6 associated peripheral neuropathy was published in the August 2008 Australian Adverse Drug Reactions Bulletin.
Information for sponsors
During the TGA investigation of this issue, we identified a number of products that did not display the required label warning. Regulatory action has been taken to ensure available products are compliant.
You are reminded of your obligations to comply with the requirements of the permissible ingredients determination. Failure to do so will lead to regulatory action, which may include the recall and/or cancellation of a product.
You are also reminded of your obligation to report all serious adverse events to the TGA within required timeframes.
Additional information
Consumers and health professionals are encouraged to report problems with medicines or vaccines. Your report will contribute to the TGA’s monitoring of these products.
The TGA cannot give advice about an individual’s medical condition. You are strongly encouraged to talk with a health professional if you are concerned about a possible adverse event associated with a medicine or vaccine.
Jane
Thanks for sharing this
This is a very dangerous situation, when government gets involved in regulating nutrients that the human body needs. B6 is one that we can’t live without. Some of us require high dosages due to methylation issues and pyroluria.
It should rather be noted that vitamin B6 has an interaction with vitamin B1 (thiamine) which can inhibit thiamine biosynthesis. For people who are already low in thiamine levels, this can result in various symptoms which include peripheral neuropathy, nerve pain, and various other symptoms – look up symptoms of thiamine deficiency. Therefore, people need to know to have their thiamine levels checked and possibly supplement with benfotiamine if levels are very low, if they have trouble assimilating thiamine, and if they need high dosages of B6 due to methylation or pyroluria problems.
I will state that B6 is NOT the problem! Especially not the active P5P version of B6. The problem is having fear of a critical nutrient that we need for life, without understanding that other nutrient deficiencies cause the symptoms in question.
For example, when you are zinc deficient, you tend to have estrogen dominance and copper toxicity. Without understanding that the problem isn’t copper, because copper is necessary for life and health, people might go on a crusade to limit availability of copper supplements, believing that copper is dangerous to some people. But copper isn’t the danger. Ignorance is. Ignorance of the necessary balance between zinc and copper is the danger. Correcting the mineral imbalance by adding zinc and whatever else that particular person suffering from copper “toxicity” might need is the key to health for that person. That person still needs copper to live and thrive.
It’s a similar situation with vitamins B6 and B1. They have to be kept in an ideal balance. People taking B6 and thinking that it’s causing them to experience peripheral neuropathy need to understand that B6 affects B1 levels, and B1 deficiency causes nerve pain/heuropathy. There is likely also a magnesium deficiency accounting for insufficient B1 levels.
There’s a lot more to it all, this is all just for an example to get my point across – the point being that it’s downright dangerous for ignorant government officials to start regulating nutrients that human bodies need for life and health.
Very dangerous and just plain erroneous advice. There are NO studies that show B6 affects B1 levels. None.
And more importantly, there is also NO clinical studies proving the need for ‘high dosages of B6’ due to methylation or “pyroluria” problems. In fact, pyroluria doesn’t exist. There is NO scientific research that backs up the hypothesis that pyroluria is a medical problem. Yes, one may have low b6 and zinc levels, that doesn’t mean pyroluria is real.
What’s “downright dangerous” is for you to suggest that B-6 — at any level above the RDA is safe.
Hi there,
I have been in a similar boat to the stories above – noticed tingling and numbness in my hands and arms and also vision issues (foggy, blur, and black floaters I’ve never experienced — are floaters part of B6toxicity? Has anyone else experienced that?) and after many work ups, neurology appts, clean MRI, a functional medicine PA tested my B6 levels which were double the normal limit.
I realized the prenatal vitamin id been taking for nearly 3 years (back to back pregnancies) had 12mg in it.
When I stopped taking it (about 6 weeks ago) I saw improvement and am feeling much better now but still occasional lingering symptoms.
The doctors I’ve told my theory to – that it was B6 toxicity – don’t seem convinced that’s what it was but it makes too much sense to me.
Questions for Trudy and other sufferers – how long before symptoms went away completely? Anyone else experiencing lingering vision issues specifically eye floaters? Is there anything I can do to speed up the detox process?
Thank you!
B6 causes B1 (thiamine) insufficiency when B1 levels are already low, and not replenished when B6 is supplemented. Thiamine deficiency causes various symptoms, including neuropathy, nerve pain, tingling, blurry vision, gut issues – basically a whole lot of things. People blame B6 for toxicity, but that is not the case. The problem is that the B6/B1 imbalance has caused B1 deficiency that needs to be addressed. In low B1 cases, look into magnesium levels, as they may be low and need to be supplemented, and consider benfotiamine supplementation as well. Always a good idea to use a B complex rather than supplementing one B vitamin which may cause imbalances with the others, but if B1 is seriously low, benfotiamine can be extremely helpful.
For more about benfotiamine, here’s one good resource:
https://supplements.selfdecode.com/blog/health-benefits-benfotiamine/
Maybe it’s to do with other B vitamin deficiencies – agonists and antagonists. For example, vitamin B1 (thiamine) deficiency is known to be a culprit behind neuropathy and a bunch of other symptoms. B1 and B6 are agonists for each other – they work together, however they are also antagonists. Meaning that too much of one when the other is deficient can cause symptoms unless the deficient one is increased when the other is. That’s why B complexes are so important. Calcium, copper, and iron are also antagonists to B6 and vice versa. So it might be as simple as finding out which deficiency someone has as a result of taking B6 that might be causing the nerve pain. It also could explain why the neuropathy remains after so long a time after the B6 should have been flushed out of the body as a water soluble vitamin – because the B6 was only the trigger that people identify as the problem without understanding that it’s pointing to another serious deficiency that needs to be identified as the true root cause. If this is unknown, the person suffering will likely not restore and replenish the necessary nutrient. As it stays depleted, the symptoms persist, while the person suffering thinks they can’t take B6, which may actually be something they desperately need!
Another reason why pyradoxine HCL might be problematic could possibly be due to missing or deficient liver enzymes (pyridoxal (PL)kinase and pyridoxine-5’-phosphate (PNP) oxidase) that would normally convert it to active P5P which is beneficial and necessary for life, but without the means to convert it, the synthetic B6 can’t be used and perhaps can’t be cleared out, which may possibly account for toxicity issues. I don’t know for sure that this would cause the nerve problems, or if the synthetic B6 would just be flushed out, though perhaps also behaving as antagonist to thiamine, for example.
I would look into thiamine deficiency, first and foremost, when investigating neuropathy or nerve pain or any other symptom that crops up as a result of taking vitamin B6. Thiamine deficiency is actually quite prevalent. I’d look into benfotiamine supplementation if it’s indicated, and I’d also be working towards proper balance of all vitamins and minerals, fatty acids, aminos and enzymes, looking into which ones work together in which quantities, which ones deplete each other, and which medications (if any are being used) might also be depleting various vitamins, minerals, aminos, fatty acids, and enzymes. I’d be looking into EVERY possible deficiency that might cause the symptoms, and seeing if B6 is antagonistic to that particular nutrient, and if so, I would definitely see about replenishing that nutrient to see if it corrects the problem, rather than vilifying such a nutrient as B6 that our bodies can’t make, that we can’t get enough of in our diet, and that we absolutely cannot live without. Getting to the true root cause in cases like this is absolutely essential.
Also if someone’s doing any kind of detox, you’re going to want to look into what you’re using. I used zeolite years ago after researching it and believed it was safe. Later, a research study came out that shows that zeolite adsorbs vitamins B1, B2, and B6. Recently I did a detox using zeolite, without knowing about the later study until after I experienced severe symptoms of B1 and B6 depletion – that was how I found out that zeolite adsorbs these vitamins. Oops. So it definitely pays off to really investigate anything taken for detox for interactions with nutrients, even if you investigated it a dozen years ago. There may have been a new study since then with vital information you need to know.
Forgive me for not having any links for any of this, it’s just a lot that I’ve learned through the years. Should be easy enough to look into. Apologies also if any of this has already been covered, as I realize I’m a few years late finding this article and commenting. Hope this is helpful for someone!
Tricia
I’m on the same page as you. I just haven’t had time to gather all the research and articulate it. Thanks for posting all this
Thanks Trudy! I sure do appreciate your work. Thank goodness for you and all you do! I’ve been trialing with various amino acids I learned about from your work, and they sure do help a lot. I’m so deeply grateful to you!
Hi Tricia
I didn’t have neuropathy just intense aching muscles for a few years which was felt all over every day. I stopped taking BComplex and after 1 month the aching has gone. My blood test showed all my B levels were within range except B6, which were abnormally high. You’re right we all need to test not guess when it comes to vitamins and only take what we need.
As for governments getting involved in our health, we’ll thank goodness they do and I live in Australia! It’s not the Wild West here and I’m grateful that responsible warnings were issued about B6. B6 is not the enemy but it’s dosing. Have you had your B’s tested?
Jane
Jane,
Did you retest when your symptoms disappeared and find that your b6 levels were back down? Thank you for your contribution to the conversation I have found your comments very helpful!!!
Hello thank you everyone for sharing. I currently have a b6 level of 22.3 nh/mL. slightly above 21 which is the standard. My doctor told me it’s a mild level nothing too severe. Has anybody had levels higher than that and it went away? I was taking apetamin it’s an appetite stimulated. And ironically it causes me gas issues and im unable to sleep. I’ve took low doses for 2 years. And now I feel tingling sensation in my feet and hands. I’ve had it for 2 months now. Very anxious and worried.
Hi Trudy
You wrote, February 12, 2019 at 9:00 pm
Karla
I too have never tested vitamin B6 levels as I was taught it doesn’t correlate with vitamin B6 status. I would like to understand more about B6 testing and when we see high levels….
Trudy,
I’m curious have you since had your B6 levels tested? And if you could share where you were taught that B6 blood levels do not correlate with B6 status? What does this mean? Can you provide a link to this research please.
It might help people like myself understand why my levels are so high.
My B markers on the OAT test indicate that I am not B deficient. And as I’ve mentioned all my Bs are at the high end of the range except B6 which is off the charts.
It’s a vicious cycle because some readers on high levels of B6 are going to feel the stimulant quality of B6 which can present as anxiety like symptoms, and mistakingly increase their intake of B6 and other aminos.
Jane
Jane
I’ve attended a number of conferences where we’ve been told that plasma B6 is not a reliable test of vitamin B6 status and not to be used for testing to see if vitamin B6 levels are high.
Per this Labcorp description https://www.labcorp.com/tests/004655/vitamin-b-sub-6-sub-plasma, “it is used to detect vitamin B6 deficiency.” Even with this description I would not use it for assessing for B6 deficiency.
I’d love to see these labs of someone who has these suspected B6 toxicity issues and has elevated plasma B6 – Spectracell B6, homocysteine (marker for low B6, folate and B12), B12 and MMA (low B12 has many of the symptoms that folks describe), xanthurenate and kynurenate/kynurenic Acid (on OAT and Dutch tests – elevated levels can indicate B6 deficiency. I’d also want to know what dream recall is like (no dream recall or nightmares indicates low B6), if they have pyroluria (low B6 is common), oxalate issues/markers on OAT (low B6 can occur with some folks), birth control use (lowers vitamin B6) and other meds that lower B6. This is not a comprehensive list and just me thinking out aloud.
As mentioned I’ll do more digging when I’m back in Australia
Hi Trudy
Rachel Arthur is one of Australia’s top Nutritionists, she has a 40min podcast $25 on B6 toxicity that covers Hadstein & Vrolijk 2020 paper on B6 and neuropathy.Rachel discuss the form, dose, duration and individual pharmacokinetics that lead to toxicity.
It’s definitely worth listening to if you don’t have the time to do the research.
Were We Wrong – Is B6 Da Bomb?
29 Oct 2021 | Clinic, FAQ, News
And not in a good way, right. While we’ve known about the potential for peripheral neuropathy with excess B6 supplementation since the 1980s, currently there’s a seismic shift in our sense of safety even with previously regarded ‘safe’ levels. You may have heard individual whispers, or the chorus of voices coming together, both here and overseas, belonging to members of the public who report suffering sensory nerve impairment with as little as 2mg/d! Is this a mess of mis-diagnosis, false attribution & nocebo? Perhaps for some, but certainly not for all.
How could this be the case given the many RCTs employing hundreds of mgs per day over months, with no such events recorded?
How could this be given, your (?), certainly my, high dose prescriptions, with only 1 case of quickly reversed, peripheral neuropathy in over 20 years, on my books?
The pieces of this complex paradoxical pyridoxine puzzle are coming to light.
Is it the form?, the dose? the duration? individual differences in B6 metabolism & toxicity threshold? amplification of risk secondary to levels of other nutrients, or the use of certain medications? Yes. And we need to understand each element to better tailor every B6 prescription to the individual & mitigate risk. I have spent the best part of this month reading almost every paper on this from the 1970s to last month and I am now alarmed but more importantly, alert, to what prescription practice changes we can all make to lessen the risk, and control the power of B6. It’s been the most compelling deep-dive. Because in spite of a clear TGA warning issued last year that likely prompted the quiet removal of high dose products from market, it would seem none of the companies have the courage to have this difficult conversation with us I invite you to ‘feel the fear & do it anyway’ & listen in to our latest Update in Under 30.
Dynamics and Dangers of B6 – Controlling the Power
Haven’t we always known that nutritional medicine is a potent prescription? Now thanks to more sophisticated research we have a much greater understanding of this and of both the intended and unintended effects of micronutrient supplements that have the potential to achieve supra-physiological levels. B6 metabolism is arguably the most complex of the Bs – involving 6 different forms, at least 2 of which are active – and exhibiting some of the most complicated regulatory control designed to both harness the power & limit the accompanying risks. Excess B6 supplementation, however, has long been known to present as peripheral neuropathy in some individuals and case reports of this are growing, at lower and lower doses. New information has come to light to help us understand the why, the how and better still how to mitigate risk to our patients.
You can purchase Dynamics and Dangers of B6 – Controlling the Power here.
If you are an Update in Under 30 Subscriber, you will find it waiting for you in your online account.
You can become an Update in Under 30 Subscriber to access this episode and the entire library of Update in Under 30 audio’s and resources here.
Thanks Jane – I’ll get a chance to dive into all this when I’m back in Australia in December. But keep the information coming – I do respect Rachel’s work
My husband developed b6 toxicity and high iron in his blood after testing positive for Covid. He was barely functioning and finally got to the point where he couldn’t work. We are still in the discovery phase to see if there are any other issues but he was healthy and functioning before Covid. He has been out of work for 2 1/2 months because of the neuropathy and the fatigue from the high iron. I was wondering if anyone else has had these issues develop after Covid.
I strongly believe the synthetic form of B6 is the reason for toxicity, and that this phenomenon does not receive enough attention since synthetic b vitamins remain a cost effective method of meeting daily nutritional levels in foods. For many years, I suffered with interstitial cystitis and could not tolerate any oral b vitamin supplements, as they would exponentially increase my symptoms. After over a decade of resulting deficiency, I stumbled upon some research specifically indicating that pyridoxine hydrochloride may be the issue, and that high levels of this compound have proven neurotoxic. I now take a daily b multivitamin containing only the natural, phosphorylated versions of the vitamins and have corrected my deficiencies with no ill effects. I also completely reversed my “incurable” IC by discovering it was actually a transcobalamin II deficiency requiring B12 injections, but that is a separate topic.
I am experiencing tingling and burning in my feet, and was recommended a B6 and B12 supplement by my physician. The burning is now worse and I’m having trouble sleeping.
You mentioned that “B6 toxicity… I have also not ever recommended more than 500mg/day.”
and “…amounts of 50 mg or greater are considered therapeutic and a high dose, and you should reduce your dose if you notice any tingling in your fingers and other extremities.”
When the tingling and burning first started, I was on a “Super B Complex” with B6 (as Pyridoxine Hydrochloride) 2 mg, B12 (as Cyanocobalamin) 15 mcg.
The new supplement from the doctor has B6 (as Pyridoxal 5′-Phosphate) 45 mg, and B12 (as Methylcobalamin) 3 mg (notice the 15 “MCG” of previous pill compared to new 3 “MG”). –It does have “125,000% of DV” after the B12 3mg.
I may have noticed that some people have spoken of taking so many “mg” of B12, when it is probably “mcg”. I don’t have the time to go back and read your entire article or the respondent’s entries, but wanted to clarify the difference.
I have been taking Pyrrole Protect by Bioceuticals as well as other supplements. About the same time not long after taking this, I developed aching, tight calf muscles. I first started with a cramp in both calf muscles. I am guessing its from this supplement. I have been taking it for a bout 2 months total, but the aching started about 2 weeks after starting it.
Is this b6 toxicity or something else?
Andrew
Magnesium can be depleted by high dose vitamin B6 and cramps in muscles sound more like low magnesium.
Hmmm. Thanks for your reply. There is magnesium in that supplement and I also take fusion magnesium, so I could look into if this enough. Since stopping the Pyrolle capsules I see a dramatic easing of the tightness. I have been taking 1 pyrrole tablet in am and another in pm with 2 fusion magnesium tablets as well as other stuff. Also, at night started taking taurine and that combo with pyrrole tablets have helped waking up at 4am. Nothing else had worked until started on Pyrrole product which was nice.
I have had peripheral neuropathy (PN) for many years now with specialists unable to determine a cause. A little while ago there was a news report of someone who was unable to walk due to PN and it was found this individual had B6 levels way above the normal range. Doctors determined that the cause was B6 Toxicity. The person was taking daily B6 supplements. The report concluded by saying the person has stopped taking the supplement but it was not yet known if the damage is permanent. { https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-08-05/vitamin-b-toxicity-peripheral-neuropath-deficiency-b6/101296070 }
Soon after reading the report I requested a B6 blood test from my Doctor and my level was found to be over 10 times the maximum normal level. The only supplement I was taking was a daily multivitamin which had 30mg of B6. I stopped taking that immediately and a blood test result this week shows my level is back into the normal range. It is still too soon to know if the loss of feeling I have in my lower legs will improve.
My take-away …
Most people will excrete excess B6 so there is no advantage in taking high doses and some people will suffer consequences with even small amounts of supplemental B6. If in doubt get a B6 blood test to make sure that any supplements you take are not pushing you outside the normal range.
Mike
Thanks for sharing and please continue to seek answers as high B6 levels don’t necessarily confirm that this is the issue. If it is the issue, and your symptoms improve, I’m happy for you. Please do keep us posted.
Thank you so much for this- you are a saviour. Although I’ve been experiencing several B12 deficiency symptoms, my bloodwork has repeatedly presented very high levels of both B6 (low on OAT but high on blood test) and B12. I too have tested positive for SIBO and am having many autoimmune-related issues. I will definitely join the ‘Understanding B12 deficiency’ FB group. The info you provided above is so helpful and enlightening. I’m looking forward to learning more about the protocol. Thank you again! I cannot tell you how life changing your post is for me!
I have PN which has progressed over the last 6 months from simply a numbness in my toes in early 2022 to now affecting both my legs and hands. I was also recently experiencing red and hot and itchy toes, particularly at night. The progression, but not the initial numbness, could be due to taking daily supplements of 50mg of B6. I also take daily hypertension tablets which contain a mild diuretic.
I stopped the B6 supplements 2 weeks ago and the hot foot problem has now gone but the sensory neuropathy is slightly worse than before. (I wonder if the foot problems are an early warning sign.)
“It will get worse before it gets better” when you stop taking B6 is the warning on the website https://understandingb6toxicity.com/ and on the associated facebook group. So perhaps my PN will gradually improve.
Hi Vanessa, is there any way we could connect? I’ve tried looking for and joining the above Facebook group but can’t seem to find it. Thank you!
I too have discovered that I have B6 toxicity after being sick for over a year due to drinking Liquid IV electrolyte drinks daily along with taking the occasional High Potency Whole Food B-Complex Formula from Garden of Life. I had blood tested twice and B6 was high. The first time we brushed it off because I had taken the B-comlex the day before the test. About 8 months later I had it tested again by a different doctor and it was still high, only this time I wasn’t taking any B vitamins.
After a lot of digging and a ton of research I discovered I have one MTHFR gene variant which I believe contributed to my inability to properly methylate B vitamins. B6 became as a neurotoxin in my body and it is extremely hard to recover from it. My symptoms started with heart palpitations, numbness and tingling in my arms while sleeping along with a stabbing headache and feeling like my breathing was very shallow. I actually thought I might have had a stroke in my sleep. It gradually progressed to severe sleep disturbances, cardiac issues, neuropathy, and autonomic dysfunction.
ER visits were pointless. They just assume you have anxiety. My symptoms consist of bone, muscle, and nerve pain, migraines, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, burdensome PVC’s (for which I had to be put on an anti-arrhythmia medication), chest pain, shortness of breath, bounding pulse, low BP, low heart rate, debilitating fatigue, problems with mental clarity, circulation issues, dehydration, dental issues (sudden onset of teeth grinding), muscle loss, facial numbness, tingling in arms and legs, involuntary jerking moments, hair loss, neurological itching, skin rashes (had to get prescription meds for this), and exercise intolerance. I also have Hashimoto’s Thyroiditis and Hypothyroidism. There are more symptoms as these neurological symptoms seem to constantly change.
As far as things that have helped me… hydration is very important and exercise (even if I can’t do much) makes a huge difference especially with the muscle loss. Making sure I get sleep. Sleep disturbances are a very big part of this and it is absolutely debilitating. Everything snowballs if I don’t sleep. I was able to get a prescription for Hydroxyzine (an allergy med) which was the only thing that would help me stay asleep. I no longer need this med, but I am grateful that I had something to help me sleep. I am now taking a whole food all natural beef liver supplement that has also helped me tremendously, and drinking adrenal cocktails daily. I have been off of B6 supplements for about 2 months now, and although I am still struggling, I think I’m healing. I no longer have the PVC’s or chest pain and I can sleep through the night without meds. I hope this info helps someone…
Tracy,
How long were you taking the liquid IV and occassional b vitamins before you stopped taking them? Were you continuing to take them even after having symptoms? How long do you think after stopping the b vitamins did it take for the PVCs to go away?? I know by two months you say they were already gone….did it happen even earlier than that? How are you doing now? Do you think you’ve gotten it all out? Have you retested? Thank you for your post. I hope you see this reply and can write back.
Hi Brooke,
I started drinking liquid IV probably in October of 2021 and my symptoms began in mid-January 2022. I looked up some of my symptoms and kept reading that a B-complex could help, so I got a good quality whole food B-complex probably within a few months of becoming symptomatic in January 2022 and was still drinking Liquid IV because I was reading how electrolyte imbalance could cause some of my symptoms as well. I don’t believe the B-complex caused the B6 toxicity because it was a whole-food supplement that I had taken in the past with no issues. The issue was the synthetic B6 in the Liquid IV (Pyridoxine) that I now know my body cannot methylate so it was building up in my bloodstream and causing neurotoxicity. My cardiologist drew my B6 in May of 2022 and it was high, but at that time there was no concern about it. I drank those damn things for over a year having one to two packets a day before I finally figured out that it was the cause of my mystery illness. I went to see another neurologist in January of 2023 and he had the wisdom to draw my B6. When I saw that it was still high I was perplexed because at that time I was not taking any B supplements, but I was still drinking Liquid IV and that is when I was able to put the pieces together. Ironically, I stopped drinking the Liquid IV at the very beginning because I wanted to cut everything out to see if these symptoms were from something I was taking, but because I didn’t realize that it was B6 toxicity and that it stays in your system for a very long time, I assumed it was not the Liquid IV causing this because I was still sick when I stopped drinking them. So, I started drinking them again thinking I ruled them out and was just continuing to poison myself. I stopped drinking them in January of 2023 and the chest pain and palpitations began to slowly improve and got much better after about 2 months or so. But I did A LOT of independent research and began a detox regimen, started a health protocol called The Root Cause Protocol by Morley Robbins, and completely changed my diet and lifestyle. I joined a B6 toxicity group that has its own protocol but while some of the info there was very helpful and useful I was not in agreement with some of their unhealthy methods and theories so I went out on my own, and with the help of God above who guided me, I am now well and healthier than I was before this all started. In May of 2023, I felt a lot better but still had some symptoms. I had my B6 drawn again and it was actually higher than it was in January of that year. This was because I was now eating a healthy diet of mostly meat and vegetables which are naturally high in B6. Even though my levels were higher, I felt much better. This is how I knew it was the synthetic B6 causing the horrible symptoms. So I went to work again and finally found the missing piece that keeps the body from detoxing and that was inflammation. I also have an autoimmune disease (Hashimoto’s thyroiditis) which is inflammation of the thyroid. I didn’t realize that this inflammation was playing a huge part in the body’s inability to detox the B6. I had to then research ways to reduce inflammation. Once I added that to the regimen, everything fell into place and I was finally truly on the road to recovery. I went from thinking I was going to die (literally) or have such a poor quality of life that I would be a burden to my family for the rest of my life to thriving again but it took A LOT of research, work, trust in God, and discipline. I could tell when the B6 was gone by the way I felt so I had my doctor draw it in October of 2023 and it was in normal range. I know how life-altering B6 toxicity is. I would be happy to share the details of what I did which included diet, supplements, exercise, ways to reduce inflammation, hydration, and intermittent fasting if you like. God bless!
Tracy,
Thank you so much for all that information! It is so good to hear that even though you were taking them for that long and your levels were high that you were able to get them down and that the heart symptoms went away relatively quickly. I have a similar situation. I was taking very low b6 in a multi only 2 mg but that was enough to cause tingling and blurry vision over months. I didn’t put it together and didn’t think for a second that could be what it was until two separate times trying a liquid IV and then later taking 50 mg of b6 by itself. Then I KNEW what it was and went looking for information. I am so glad I found this site and there are people like you on here willing to help. I already left a review of the b6 I took warning people to get educated about b6 toxicity before ever taking anything with it in it. What I think is interesting is that both the multis that I had been taking had the methylated natural version of b12 and folate which I knew to look for but they had the synthetic version of b6. And what is even more confusing is that I called garden of life because it has b6 pyridoxine HCI listed as the b6 and says that it is from whole food. That’s not possible. The lady said she couldn’t answer that one and would have to talk to the formulators and email me an answer. We’ll see what they say. And yes! I would very much love and appreciate details on what you have done to heal! Thank you so much for writing me back I am so grateful to God that I found this page. I know most things say you have to take much more b6 than what is in a multi in order to become toxic but peoples stories on here make it clear that some have problems with even small amounts. They gave no option to reply to your reply to me so I am replying to the original again. Thanks again for taking the time!
Wow! I was taking garden of life Bcomplex too(because i thought it was food based) but I didn’t notice if it had synthetic B or not. I know trying to figure all of this out was the worst and on top of it being sick…. it was so hard. I don’t wish it upon anyone, so if I can help I will! it would be easier to correspond with you via email or something because I’dlike to ask you some more questions. I’ll post my email address for you to contact me in a separate reply and then delete it after you’ve contacted me so it’s not floating around or there for everyone to see. lol
tracyforfilm@yahoo.com
I have a recent experience taking 50 mg B6. I started it because I suspected I was low, as I have MCAS and was struggling with reactions and tongue soreness. The B6 resolved my reactions and tongue soreness, gave me tons of energy, and more vivid dreams if I took it at night so I started taking it during the day. However, my period, which has been very regular always, went for 18 days straight with heavy bleeding for at least six of those days and breast tenderness, which I normally do not have. It was scary and I felt horrible and light-headed to the point where I almost went to the hospital. I suspected the 50 mg was too much for me, so I stopped the B6. I am waiting to see if my period will be normal this cycle. I should say, I am 49 so at the age where my cycle could be changing, but this seems too much of a coincidence for me not to consider that B6 supplementation may have played a role. I have heard of a few other women experiencing this longer period with B6. I am planning to start only 25 mg B6 after this as it gave me huge benefits, but also seemingly a huge problem with my hormones! I would very much appreciate any thoughts on this. Thank you!
Hi Julia, did your cycles go back down to normal?
No one should take vitamin or supplements without being tested first to determine whether or not they have a deficiency. It is a senseless and reckless practice to so otherwise. Just because you have reasoned that it’s “good to have your bases covered, you want to “be safe,” or you take them “just in case” or whatever other reasons you might justify why it is okay, you might ask yourself this, “What are vitamins?” If you cannot genuinely and intelligently answer this question, you shouldn’t be mindlessly swallowing them. Just because a product is sold over the counter does not make it’s safe to take, especially in massive doses that far exceed the standards put forth by researchers. The entire field of vitamin research leaves a lot to be discovered. There’s much we still do not understand. A while back I submitted to a complete profile of metabolic tests to determine whether I had any inherent metabolic disorders. My B6 level was excessive, not dangerously so but not within the norm. I do not take supplements. The underlying cause is due to a genetic anomaly/ mutation. oftentimes we read articles that explain how taking this can help with that, that certain nutritional components are vital to good health and therefore should be supplementing our diet. Illness looms in every article written. People become fearful that “this can happen if you don’t take that” and so forth. But you cannot take remedies for health issues you might not have in the first place. Would you take a blood thinner if you didn’t know if you needed it or not? You could cause yourself to bleed to death doing something like that!
For 12 years I owned a natural foods and vitamin store and worked with people trying to regain or recover the health. if there’s one thing I learned it’s that there is no Magic Bullet. If you do not follow a proper “fit for human consumption” diet, then all the pills in the world aren’t going to fix you. I’ve seen people remedy critical health conditions with diet alone. A few years back I was informed that I had a double mutation MTHFR c677t t. It’s an enzyme deficiency that affects how one processes and utilizes B9/methylfolate. Also, B12 and B6 are known to be affected. Overwhelmed by this information, informed of DVT and the possibility of impending cardiovascular strokes, I ran out and bought the highest quality B9 and B12 available. I took them immediately. An hour later I developed a splitting headache! I don’t typically get headaches! Could this be a coincidence? The next day I took them again the same thing happened. I tried one more day and of course it happened again . It was so blatantly obvious that the vitamins had brought on the headache. I knew I was NOT on the right track. On the 4th day I got my blood results back. Shocker, I didn’t have a deficiency of B9 or B12, nor did I have any other abnormalities typically associated with this genetic mutation . By rushing to take the supplements blindly, I was essentially overdosing …and hence the side effects–headaches. This is not to say that I have had no effects from this mutation because the truth is, it has caused problems. I have a glitch in the methylation process involved in the function of this enzyme, it renders me totally incapable of metabolizing onions and garlic or any other foods in the “Allium” family. I suffered a good deal of my life with this undiagnosable issue– food intolerance. Eventually I was able to isolate what was causing me to be ill. You can’t eat something that you cannot metabolize — it poisons you. It makes you ill. I ate onions/ garlic for years before I discovered how ill was actually making me. I developed an autoimmune disorder. No wonder. Discussing this challenge with two different geneticists and being informed that there is simply not enough research Into the depths of how our bodies work and how our genes oversee how we function, grow, and rejuvenate… from moment, I had to resign myself that my only option was to avoid the offending foods. Discovering the obstacles that prevent us from enjoying full health is daunting. There are many stories yet to be told. As many have of you have already discovered, trying to remedy yourself by taking substances that you might not need and can potentially cause more problems than you already have is not a good practice. Get tested first. Just bear in mind, like in my case, you can have an overabundance of a vitamin or other substance in your blood with no explainable/known cause. Take care of what you believe when reading articles written by alleged authorities. Scholarly articles are the best way to go.
The safest way to take vitamins, if you must, is to stick with products that are made wholly of food stuffs, that is, compressed foods with nothing synthetic added.
My own experience is this:
Had 54 mcg/l P5P in blood, after 4 weeks with only 7 mg pyrodoxin on average every day, i had 105 mcg/l, and I’m not talking mol here, so this is very high.
I had P5P raises 2 times before, first time I thought my supplements was wrongly produced, second time a I used a medicament which are well analysed and have tight boundarys for product variations. That time I thought i was just too high with 25mg. After this third raise that seeemd so absurd that i googled and found this page.
Reading through comments I found:
MTHFR might be relevant (only 677 and 1298 or also others?)
Low ALP might be relevant
ALP was near upper limit so I don’t think that might be case for me and MTHFR I haven’t tested. But I think the best way to prove is to take a supplement with the right b6 form and test P5P in blood before and after and check if the level actually lowered.
Had haemochromatosis and have chronic lack of sleep.
What to do? Stop b6 supplementation and try well defined pyridoxale supplementation with lab test before and after and check MTHFR? Anything else? Even the experiences of others here are mostly with higher doses. I mean 7mg for 4 weeks and such a raise, wow. Had problems with b-complexes before with low as 300% of daily recommendations for all b-vitamins. Tooks 1-2 a day and had after a few weeks problems that i couldn’t sleep. And my lack of sleep was lesser then. So does not seem to have anything to do with that. Would appreciate a repsond.
Answers to questions above:
What were/are your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues? sleep problems and not feeling feelings well
Have you resolved the symptoms and if yes how? –
Did you make any other changes around the same time i.e. stopping and/or other nutritional support? –
Was it vitamin B6/pyridoxine or P5P you were taking? Pyridoxine
And how much did you take and how often? 7mg on average every day
If you have pyroluria were you also taking zinc and how much? (Dr. Pfeiffer recommended taking zinc together with vitamin B6). 25mg zinc
Past history or current use of medications like benzodiazepines (such as Ativan, Xanax, valium etc.), gabapentin, Lyrica, BCP / birth control pill, SSRIs /antidepressants (such as Prozac, Celexa, Lexapro, Paxil, Zoloft etc.), fluroquinolone antibiotics (such as ciprofloxacin/Cipro, gemifloxacin/Factive, levofloxacin/Levaquin, moxifloxacin/Avelox, norfloxacin/Noroxin and ofloxacin/Floxin), PPIs (proton pump inhibitors such as Nexium for heart-burn), diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc.? no
What kind of EMF exposure do you have – WiFi in the home and/or at work, how much cell phone use in a day, cordless phones at home and/or work and a smart meter at home? cell phone with low sar value and wifi lowered engery
What kind of exposure have you had to GMOs and pesticides (i.e. do you only eat organic food), glyphosate (eg. Roundup exposure from lawns, golf courses, parks etc.), plastics/phthalates (do you avoid plastics)? 1/2 organic food
What polymorphisms do you have: cytochrome P450 polymorphisms (we know some of these make benzodiazepines more toxic and more difficult to taper in about 60% of those prescribed these meds), and/or MTHFR polymorphism (may affect our detox ability if it’s expressing) and others you know about? i don’t know
Did you take a B complex (or a multivitamin that contains all the B vitamins) with the vitamin B6? no, i used more single vitamines, but all
Did you also take magnesium with the vitamin B6 and if yes how much? (Bernie Rimland reported that taking vitamin B6 together with magnesium resulted in an improved behavior of ASD (autism spectrum patients)) 400 mg
Have you observed any correlation with intake of dietary oxalates i.e. worsening symptoms when consuming medium or high oxalate foods (such as spinach, kale, berries, nuts, kiwi fruit, eggplant etc.) or using vitamin C or milk thistle, and less severe symptoms when consuming a low oxalate diet? (Susan Owens is founder of http://www.lowoxalate.info and shares that vitamin B6 is the most efficacious vitamin for reducing oxalates and that we also don’t know if the classic signs of vitamin B6 toxicity has anything to do with oxalate dumping symptoms.) I don’t know
Do you have a thyroid disease? “peripheral diseases frequently include polyneuropathy” No
Have you been diagnosed with an autoimmune condition and if yes, which one? No
Berger
Thanks for sharing all this. There are so many causes of chronic lack of sleep and too much vitamin B6 is not one I’d consider. Even a small amount of B6 (7mg) with elevated B6 lab work would not make me concerned.
Instead I’d explore diet, food issues (gluten, oxalates, sugar), caffeine, high cortisol, low cortisol, gut health, EMFs, SIBO, parasites etc
do u think b1 or b2 could increase b6 to toxic levels thx
I have body wide neuropathy that recently has become even worse. Blood work showed a level of 646. Upper limit is 125. I recently started taking a B complex supplement with 5mg B6. After seeing my blood level I started checking my meds, and my melatonin has 10 mg in it . I have been taking the melatonin for years, but didn’t take the supplement daily. Yet I have bad neuropathy. So now I am going to push the Doctor to figure out why I went so high on a small amount. I have lots of issues, hopefully this can give me an answer.
Carol
Can you kindly share your actual symptoms (describe them), the steps that led to you having vitamin B6 tested and who did the testing (family doctor or neurologist)? Do they attribute your symptoms to vitamin B6 intake? And what form was the vitamin B6 – pyridoxine or P5P?
Can you share feedback on some of the other questions posed in the blog?
Trudy,
Here’s a case study where a woman became ill on SIX milligrams of B6/day.
https://www.cureus.com/articles/199499-vitamin-b6-toxicity-secondary-to-daily-multivitamin-use-a-case-report#!/
It seems you’re the ONLY one defending insanely high doses.
Rebecca
Thanks for sharing this case study. I’ve reached out to the author to get additional information, asking if the patient now has a complete resolution of his symptoms and a return to normal serum vitamin B6 levels per the conclusion – “As with most patients with peripheral neuropathy due to vitamin B6 toxicity, this patient is expected to eventually have complete resolution of his symptoms with a return to normal serum vitamin B6 levels.”
I do have some reservations about the conclusion since there are many possible causes of the symptoms this man experienced and many other ingredients in his multivitamin.
Trudy,
With all due respect, the b6 level was TWICE what it should’ve been. I know of no other nutrient that CAUSES neuropathy, etc.. I really doubt it was from any other other ingredients, but I look forward to any response you get from the authors.
Thanks for your reply.
Thanks for your helpful blog, and for looking into this.
I experienced a traumatic event a few years ago. Although it was serious, my reaction was surprising to me and to everyone around me. I’d gone through some other serious losses in the prior decade and bounced back quickly, but this time I spiraled into a suicidal and uncharacteristically mystical depression. It took me a year to realize I was suffering from PTSD, then treatment progressed slowly. During that time—I thought totally incidentally—my left fingertips started going numb and I sought expensive massage treatment. It took one more year for me to stop taking the prenatal multi-vitamin (still not having gotten pregnant) that I’d started about a month before the trauma happened. The PTSD didn’t disappear when I quit the prenatal, but my symptoms dramatically and permanently lifted. It was a step change. Since then (over a year now) I’ve experimented with individual supplements that were in the prenatal vitamin, gotten tested for MTHFR, and while folate and B vitamins _in general_ cause noticeable irritability regardless of methylation/formulation (my husband and I call them “vitamin b****”), it’s B6 in isolation (pyridoxine or p5p) that leads to numbness/tingling, intrusive thoughts, and about two weeks of elevated heart rate notable on my Fitbit and insomnia from even a single low dose.
To answer your questions in order:
– Symptoms: See above!
– Resolved? Of course I’ll never know, but I honestly believe that if I hadn’t been taking the prenatal that I would have probably bounced back from the trauma within a year (it’s been 3+). I think the physical onslaught of the anxiety symptoms and the personality change I experienced were further traumatizing. Now I understand they were related to a supplement, but at the time I thought that I was genuinely permanently changed and that idea was horrifying.
– Other changes? I started drinking caffeine and became more vegetarian
– Type? “Vitamin B6 (as pyridoxine HCl and pyridocal-5-phosphate)”
– How much/how often? 20mg daily
– Pyroluria? Zinc? No pyroluria, yes the prenatal included 25 mg of zinc citrate
– Past history? Yes, prior history of benzos (5 years two decades prior), yes floxies (and I have a manic/anxious reaction to them), yes short-term (less than year) use of SSRIs two decades prior)
– EMF? Yes, lots, everywhere
– Exposure? More organic than most, don’t avoid plastics but buy BPA-free
-Polymorphisms? I’m hetero MTHFR C677T and A1298C and MTR A2756G; haven’t tested cytochrome although I did quit benzos cold turkey
– Multi? It was an upmarket prenatal multi
– Magnesium? No, I’d quit because it was paradoxically aggravating my SIBO-C biofilms
– Oxalates? Yes a little weirdness with spinach and kiwi, but that could also be folate.
– Thyroid? I’d like to look into subclinical hypo as I’m always cold
– Autoimmune condition? I had been diagnosed with mitral valve prolapse dysautonomia as a teen, but then all symptoms had been gone for decades until the fated prenatal!
I would like to speak with somebody as I do have EHS from multiple cascading aspects of my health. A compromised immune system from the start with asthma and allergies Etc. Chronic lyme disease that I had acquired in 2005 but was not diagnosed until 2016. That was after having a toxic mold exposure and gas leak in my house in 2015 which ramped up all of my sensitivities and issues. Just prior to this is when I found out about my B6 toxicity from a very small dosage!
I would like to discuss this in depth but cannot be exposed to internet for long. I cannot be in the EMF as I know can have seizures and cardiac arrest from it.
But I am very curious how B6 responds to EMF frequencies and if that is my scenario with the toxicity or if maybe it correlates with Lyme disease as I am told a lot of lyme patients have issues with B vitamins. I am now not sure if it’s because it actually absorbs into the red blood cells quicker than most or if we cannot absorb it. Unfortunately there is no RBC testing for B6 so it is very tricky to determine with just serum testing.
I would love to discuss this in more detail and be a part of this path to figuring out why some people have this B6 toxicity. I’m also wondering if it is affecting my vision. There are so many aspects to this.
I do not frequent my emails so it probably will not get viewed if you email me. I would like to leave a phone number but I don’t want that to be seen in comments. But I would love to somehow get in touch and communicate more of my findings.
Wow, I never realized the potential risks of vitamin B6. This article opened my eyes as someone who relies on supplements for that extra energy boost. I usually stick to 100mg/day, but it’s reassuring to know the upper limit is considered safe. Still, it’s crucial to listen to our bodies and not push the limits. I’ve been using a B complex for a while now—it covers all the B vitamins and keeps me going without going overboard.
Be careful with the 100 mg/day.
The tolerable upper intake level (UL)for vitamin B6 was recently recommended to be set at 12.5 mg/day by the European Commission per the EFSA Panel on Nutrition, Novel Foods and Food Allergens. Other countries have also set the UL at much lower levels; the United States, however, continues to lag behind.
https://efsa.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.2903/j.efsa.2023.8006
While testing to find the underlying cause of my small fiber neuropathy a slightly elevated blood level of B6 was discovered. I was not diagnosed with B6 toxicity. I had been taking a daily multi vitamin with 3 mg of B6 that I stopped taking immediately. At the same time I was diagnosed with ventricular tachycardia frequent heartburn and depression. I was prescribed drugs that are listed as causes of drug induced neuropathy…lyrica, protonix and lopressor. I was also given Cymbalta. Now I don’t know if I should be taking any of these drugs. The Lyrica and Cymbalta seem to help the neuropathy pain. All of my symptoms the neuropathy heartburn heart palpitations and depression can be caused by too much B6. I’ve also been on Ativan for anxiety for the last 7 years. I’m in the process of tapering off of it now. It’s confusing to know what to do to improve my symptoms. Thank you for an informative article. BTW my neuropathy was labeled as idiopathic.
Karen
Thanks for sharing and sorry to hear. I’d suspect the benzodiazepine – tolerance, dependence and tapering – to be factor in all the above symptoms of neuropathy, tachycardia, heartburn and depression. Check out “What are the symptoms of benzodiazepine withdrawal” here https://benzo.org.uk/FAQ1.1.htm
Thank you Trudy. That is a very interesting article. It gives me hope that once I’m off the Ativan maybe my symptoms will get better. I have about a month to go before I finish the taper. I’m sure it will take time to completely clear my body. I’m looking forward to being free of that drug.
I have lupus, Sjogren’s and Hashimoto’s and had severe reactions after taking a single high dose B6 supplement. I had severe pain radiating down my arms and legs. I was extremely anxious and felt like I was going to die. I was in the ICU for several day and had sepsis. My doctor didn’t believe that B6 was the cause. I took it again and had extreme pain radiating down my arms and legs and hips. I again went to the ER and had a multitude of tests done. I had a lumbar puncture done which showed possible aseptic meningitis. It took several days before I could walk or function normally. Even my speech was impaired. The doctor and my insurance didn’t believe that it was caused by the B6 and I spent the following year trying to get insurance to pay for my hospital visit. I haven’t taken a B6 supplement sense. I don’t know why I would react this way. It piques my interest when I hear about B6 causing peripheral neuropathy. I would love to be validated and get to the bottom of this horrible ordeal.
Stephanie
This type of reaction is new to me and I too would not suspect B6 especially given what you say about sepsis and then meningitis. May I ask what B6 product you used, the dose and if B6 was tested?
helloooooooooo there
nice topic
i am healthy guy gymaholic – gym rats whatever you want to call me
i took all vitamins plus minerals too in low doses only one tap of both each day everything was fine
till i needed to see more change i rased doses to 2 of each everything was fine later increased to 3 times a day then four times a day between every increased years n months but when increased to 4 times aday after 3or four months i started to feel the strange burning first on my ears they turned red then i decided to take bath to clean myself n get cold water while in there i saw myshoulders n knees were red too with that burning feeling like the sun light is focused on me or a beam of laser
i doubted the new diet of taking 4 times lower it t3 times no changes then stopped everything was gone. i tested it by retaking again even if it is only one tab or eating peanut butter 100 g burning comes back after 6 minutes then i stopped again for a week everthing was gone
I took it as b complex
last time I feel the burning was today after taking b complex
i took zinc magnisume too i took all vitamins and minerals but took b comlex n some others as singl taps not multi taps that is i can quiet the ones i doubt
1 Capsule of b complex
Amount Per Serving %DV
Thiamin (as Thiamine HCl) 110 mg 9167%
Riboflavin (as Riboflavin-5-Phosphate) 10 mg 769%
Niacin (as Nicotinic Acid and Niacinamide) 140 mg 875%
Vitamin B6 (as Pyridoxine HCl and Pyridoxal-5-Phosphate) 10 mg 588%
Folate (as (6S)-5-Methyltetrahydrofolic Acid, Glucosamine Salt) 670 mcg DFE 168%
Vitamin B12 (as Methylcobalamin) 400 mcg 16667%
Biotin (as d-Biotin) 500 mcg 1667%
Pantothenic Acid (as d-Calcium Pantothenate) 110 mg 2200%
Choline (as Choline Dihydrogen Citrate) 28 mg 5%
Inositol 100 mg †
thank u a ot for sharing ur info
Allah bless you dear
can you get toxic from just taking b1 or b2 together or no
Hello, I just stopped taking Lorazepam (Benzodiazepine) 4 months ago and had the worst neurological symptoms because of it. I suffered from paresthesia in the genital area which is a symptom I could not find online. This disappeared within 2 months and i took 20 mg b6 during the withdrawal for 2 months. Now I experience a burning sensation on my hands, feet, arms, shoulders, upper back and neck. The burning sensations wanders and was worse after not taking B6 anymore. This was 5 weeks ago. There is a very slow improvement but still im wondering if this sounds like b6 toxicity to you? Is there any evidence that Benzos can contribute to the development of B6 toxicity?
Charlotte
Unfortunately benzodiazepine tapering and discontinuation can contribute to neurological and many other symptoms – see https://benzo.org.uk/FAQ1.1.htm#8
Can these benzo symptoms be tied directly with B6 though?
Is there speculation that B6 may worsen benzo withdrawal or symptoms while on benzos?
I’d be curious to know what percentage of the people having problems with B6 supplementation are vegetarian. I just read an old thread in a forum in which a vegetarian complained of having had an extreme adverse reaction to a P5P supplement. He ultimately resolved the issue by taking megadoses of B12. Vegetarianism, and veganism in particular, is notorious for B12 deficiencies.
I know it’s not politically correct to say, but let’s face it, veganism isn’t healthy. If your conscience doesn’t allow you to eat meat, you should at least allow yourself butter, eggs, and fish roe so that you don’t become severely ill. I hope this whole anti-B6 movement I’ve been discovering online today isn’t just a bunch of vegans trying to scapegoat a supplement that is harmless and beneficial to most people instead of owning up to their poor dietary decisions.
I’d be curious to know if this may one possible a factor too especially since low B12 can cause peripheral neuropathy and other neurological symptoms. I am an advocate for quality animal protein but am always polite and gentle with vegans and vegetarians so please be the same
my b2 got depleted from taking b1 even though i was taking b2 with it and i got toxic again because of a b2 deficiency supposedly any insight on this
Hi Trudy!
I’m a woman from Finland.
I took 300-350mg of B6 a day by naturopath’s advice. After 8 weeks symptoms of toxicity started: nausea, fatigue, dizzyness, blurry vision, brainfog, severe cognitive issues (unable to read and understand a written text, unable to work on a computer), short and long term memory loss, depression, anxiety and depersonalization, stomach pain, constipation, poor circulation, rapid heart rate, intoleranse to exercise and sauna, cold shivers after having a meal, blue and red skin in extremities and face, hair loss etc.
I am now 1 year and 5 months dince I stopped supplements and I still have many of those symptoms but I am recovering, very slowly. I do the fb groups B6 toxicity and western research protocol to healing. I hope I will be healed within 2 years. The recovery seems to take forever and it’s been nothing but extremely tough and fighting through every day from morning to the night. Worst thing is to lose so much time of my life. I have turned from an active and very sporty woman (I was competing in strength competitions and seeing friends many times a week, always planning for trips in holidays) to nothing less than a hermit. B6 toxicity is a big suffering for a person.
Kesia
I’m sorry to hear of your struggles and encourage folks with symptoms like you describe to look for other possible causes too.
Hi Trudy!
I wrote this in here because there is no doubt it isn’t b6 toxicity. I was healthy before the b6 vitamines and after taking the high dose b6 300-350mg a day, two months later I was a hermit with 30 symptoms. I never been that sick in my life. I ran 5 pages of blood tests during the first year of toxicity just in hope to find something to that could be fixed for some relief. Everything was in normal range.
I am at 18 months off supplements and the b6 protocol and I’m finally becoming back to my healthy self. I’m not blurry anymore. I can read a book. I can have a conversation with people without extra effort. I remember things much better. I have a lot of more energy, my energy is maybe 60% back. I still get very bad flares if I get dehydrated; just like they teach in fb group b6 toxicity and western research. That’s why I need 3-5 liters if liquid every day including 3l of salted water and 0.5l pomegranate&orange juice or coconut warer.
wats ur diet like im dealing with bad palpatations still
wats ur diet like low b6 or no
Kaisa
Thank you for the additional clarification and glad to hear you are improving. May I ask what vitamin B6 levels were and how they have changed? And what B6 protocol you have been following?
Flax seed. Eat flaxseed meal. Western medicine acts like there’s no way to lower stuck b6, that is false. Flaxseed. Thank me later.
Hi, I think I have been having eye twitching for the last 6-12 months from this issue, but I’m testing it now. I wrote a medium article with the details and history of what I have been experience even though it is mild
The weird thing is that the dosage from the multivitamins is only .5 mg per gummy and I was taking 2-4 per day, usually 2. The thing is that since I came across this article, I’ve stopped all the multi and other vitamins, but only the multi had B6. I also stopped eating the whole grain cheerios every day with a banana for breakfast as they cheerios have B6, and so do the bananas. I also stopped the avocadoes and nuts that I snack on. About a week from stopping all of that, it seems that the eyelid twitching is nearly completely gone, except when it comes back from stress or eye strain, but it feels so much better. I still have some mild pulsations like electrical buzzing in my lower legs/calves. I’m going to write a follow up to the article I wrote above over the weekend with my thoughts.
This is another disturbing article that I discovered:
https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/i-couldn-t-walk-gp-s-personal-story-of-vitamin-b6
Kareem
In situations like this I have clients explore other root causes too – like low magnesium, oxalates, gluten/caffeine/alcohol intake, low vitamin D, low B12 etc
I removed the link to your article since it was a subscription only link – feel free to share a summary here.